37 replies to this topic

[Gothic Raven]

Who do you think BioWare and Lucas Arts should have made a romance. Frankly I think Juhani should have been one. You can save her from the dark side, because of you her home plenet is destroyed, and... her wiskers are kinda sexy. Maybe Canderous too?

[The Amazing Maurice]

Juhani was written as bisexual I belive.

One person I would have liked to have seen a romance with was Yuthura-Ban - I was dissapointed when I found out she wasn't able to join the party, would have made a great NPC.

Out of the existing ones the only other logical people are Juhani and Canderous.

[Dalis'ilhea]

I think (it's a theory) that for Juhani the slaver quest happens after a number of dialoges, same for Canderous (challenge on tatoenne).

Edited by Dalis'ilhea, 25 June 2004 - 12:42 AM.

[The Amazing Maurice]

^

That's correct (on the XBOX at least). You have to go thru a certain amount of banters with said characters then go to any space port where the respective "villain" should show up.

[The Amazing Maurice]

When you find Yuthura on Dantooine that would have been the perfect moment for her to join

Oh well.

I've never had any problems with the sidequests on XBOX tho.

Also talk to Canderous on the SF after he tells you that he's lost interest in his life. (if you didn't already know)

[Cryomancer]

She was on Dantooine? *slaps self* Maybe I never knew that because I always went to Korriban after Dantooine was destroyed.

[The Amazing Maurice]

^

Yup. Gimme a few miniutes & I'll find the dialouge

[The Amazing Maurice]

Ah, seems the article I was looking for is no longer there.

Oh well.

If you want to redeem her yourself make sure you have high pursuade and ask her about her past three times. Don't tell Uthar anything and talk to her when she yeilds.

You can find her on the outskirts of the Jedi Academy near where the guy asks you to kill the Mandalorian raiders.

[SConrad]

I thought that the whole game lacks banters, not only romances.

Sure, a lot of the NPC have loads of interjections (mainly Carth and Bastila), but not very much banter.

And the existing romances (Bastila and Carth, and maybe Juhani) feels a little tiny, especially compared to the massive (in comparison) romances in BGII.

But it's clear that Carth and Bastila are the most developed NPC's in the game. Did Bioware run out of time this time as well?

[The Amazing Maurice]

Don't forget this was a console game originally.

I think (most of) the NPC's have a lot better character devolpment than BG2 - Bastilla, Carth, Canderous, Juhani, Jolee and HK-47 all have very interesting back stories. Also the game is only about 35 hours long even if you do all the sidequests.

Hopefully there will be a lot more dialouge in KotOR2

[SConrad]

Don't forget this was a console game originally.

True, but that doesn't change anything. Consolegames should also be able to include a lot of banters and interjections.

I think (most of) the NPC's have a lot better character devolpment than BG2 - Bastilla, Carth, Canderous, Juhani, Jolee and HK-47 all have very interesting back stories.

Absolutly, but you don't see it very clearly. Sure, most of them have personal quests or important additions to the main plot or the main quests, but it doesn't show like it did in BGII. Where's the personality? Everybody in KotOR joins because you either buy them, save them or because they want to help.

Where are the NPC's who joins because of own personal benefit, those who leaves if you become too good or too bad, or if you treat them like crap? It feels like they're zombies who'll follow you everywhere, and not individuals. (Droids excepted, of course).

Also the game is only about 35 hours long even if you do all the sidequests.

Very true. Impressive how you can manage to inlclude so little story (35h isn't a lot) and so little personality in the NPC's on 4 discs, and around 4GB on the drive.

Hopefully there will be a lot more dialouge in KotOR2

Amen to THAT!

[The Amazing Maurice]

True, but that doesn't change anything. Consolegames should also be able to include a lot of banters and interjections.

Fair point but thats a problem with the lazyness of console game designers more than this particular game - it probably has the most dialouge for a modern console game.

Absolutly, but you don't see it very clearly. Sure, most of them have personal quests or important additions to the main plot or the main quests, but it doesn't show like it did in BGII. Where's the personality? Everybody in KotOR joins because you either buy them, save them or because they want to help.

But you can't truly compare KotOR to BG2 due to the sheer size difference - in a 35 hour game you can hardly include 15+ NPCs that each have backstories, depth of personality etc. I'd liken the characters in KotOR to PS:T more than BG2.

It feels like they're zombies who'll follow you everywhere, and not individuals.

Each characters reasons for following the PC are explained - just because they don't choose to leave the PC is irrelavent, it also allows KotOR to have a much stronger "character driven" story than BG2.

[SConrad]

Fair point but thats a problem with the lazyness of console game designers more than this particular game - it probably has the most dialouge for a modern console game.

The reason why I NEVER play console-games.

But you can't truly compare KotOR to BG2 due to the sheer size difference - in a 35 hour game you can hardly include 15+ NPCs that each have backstories, depth of personality etc. I'd liken the characters in KotOR to PS:T more than BG2.

Precisely my point! How they managed to include so extremely little on 4 cd's and 4 GB is a wonder! Sure, the story was fantastic the first time I played it, but boring the second time. How did the normally so brilliant BioWare manage to suceed this?

Each characters reasons for following the PC are explained - just because they don't choose to leave the PC is irrelavent, it also allows KotOR to have a much stronger "character driven" story than BG2.

I disagree. You can have a story just as "character driven" with NPC's that leaves. On the contrary, you can even have more "character driven". No doubt.

But sure, why they join is perfectly explained. But not fun enough. Where's Korgan and Edwin, who only wants to join because of personal benefit (rolling in blood and power). That would be more fun. Can't someone join, just because of the fact that s/he wants to kill some sith? Or because s/he wants power, and think s/he can have it through CHARNAME? Is it really to much to ask for? *Going down on my knees in melodrama*...

[The Amazing Maurice]

Precisely my point! How they managed to include so extremely little on 4 cd's and 4 GB is a wonder! Sure, the story was fantastic the first time I played it, but boring the second time. How did the normally so brilliant BioWare manage to suceed this?

I suppose what makes the story is the twist in the middle - once you play thru again it obviously loses its "shock" value. Its fun to see all the hints & foreshadowing 2nd time around tho.

But sure, why they join is perfectly explained. But not fun enough. Where's Korgan and Edwin, who only wants to join because of personal benefit (rolling in blood and power). That would be more fun. Can't someone join, just because of the fact that s/he wants to kill some sith? Or because s/he wants power, and think s/he can have it through CHARNAME? Is it really to much to ask for? *Going down on my knees in melodrama*...

If you had the option for characters to leave then you'd probably have to chop the Bastilla segment towards the end of the game - something which would greatly diminsh the story. By not having the option for the characters to leave it allows for these things to be set in stone. I can see where this would bother some people tho.

As for your point about characters only joining for the power etc. You can count Canderous who signs up as a merc. His character development is superb tho.

I suppose there could have been more variety with the characters, but I'd sooner have a set of 8 or 9 really strong personallitys rather than 15+ who only about 4 of are likeable. But that's just my opinion

I don't know if this will be changed in KotOR 2 but each character will have their own dark/light side bar and will change over the course of the game

Besides you have HK-47, the most evil character in a RPG ever! - He makes even Korgan look redeemable

[Dalis'ilhea]

Now theres an interesting idea. Korgan and Hk-47 in the same game hehehehehehehehehe

[SConrad]

I suppose what makes the story is the twist in the middle - once you play thru again it obviously loses its "shock" value. Its fun to see all the hints & foreshadowing 2nd time around tho.

True. But it's still more fun the first time.

If you had the option for characters to leave then you'd probably have to chop the Bastilla segment towards the end of the game - something which would greatly diminsh the story. By not having the option for the characters to leave it allows for these things to be set in stone. I can see where this would bother some people tho.

I don't understand why you'd have to chop down the Bastila segment. You could easily have made a story about her leaving you if you turn too evil, only to return and fight you later, as a force of good, and YOU can turn her at that time, instead of Malak. Sure, that takes away the kidnapping (or something) which Malak commits on Levithanian, but it would have given you a lot more options. You could have choosen to either redeem her (like you can now), but also to turn her to the dark side. THAT, would be cool. You see, what I don't understand is that Malak is capable of turning her, but not Revan (you), who really is the true dark lord.

As for your point about characters only joining for the power etc. You can count Canderous who signs up as a merc. His character development is superb tho.

To be honest, I wouldn't know about his development. I never use him after Taris. Both Carth and HK-47 are better shooters, and alsa have better personality (Carth is vital to the main plot + romanceable, and HK-47 doesn't need further explanation).

I suppose there could have been more variety with the characters, but I'd sooner have a set of 8 or 9 really strong personallitys rather than 15+ who only about 4 of are likeable. But that's just my opinion

Agreed, but that's not the case here. Carth, Bastila and HK-47 are in my eyes the best developed characters in the game. That's 3.

I don't know if this will be changed in KotOR 2 but each character will have their own dark/light side bar and will change over the course of the game

Will each character have their own dark/light bar? That's great! Now, you may finally have the option to turn/redeem NPC's, like you also can in BGII (Sarevok, Viconia). Which is also strange since good vs. evil is much more important in KotOR. I thought it'd be a spellholdstudios.netcertainty that you could do that, after beeing able to in BGII.

Besides you have HK-47, the most evil character in a RPG ever! - He makes even Korgan look redeemable

You've got a point. I love HK-47.

[The Amazing Maurice]

You see, what I don't understand is that Malak is capable of turning her, but not Revan (you), who really is the true dark lord.

'Cos Bastilla is very arrogant and is tempted even early on - when she says that she struggles with the desire for the dark side. Young and naive would come into it as well. Malak dosn't want to turn Revan he wants to kill him/her

To be honest, I wouldn't know about his development. I never use him after Taris. Both Carth and HK-47 are better shooters, and alsa have better personality (Carth is vital to the main plot + romanceable, and HK-47 doesn't need further explanation).

If you play thru his dialouges up till the Star Forge you'll see he has a lot of depth - won't spoil anything tho.

Agreed, but that's not the case here. Carth, Bastila and HK-47 are in my eyes the best developed characters in the game. That's 3.

I'd add Jolee, Canderous & Juhani to that list. Admitedly Mission, Zallbar and T3-M4 are dissapointing.

Will each character have their own dark/light bar? That's great! Now, you may finally have the option to turn/redeem NPC's, like you also can in BGII (Sarevok, Viconia). Which is also strange since good vs. evil is much more important in KotOR. I thought it'd be a certainty that you could do that, after beeing able to in BGII.

Yup, should be good