Time of Troubles
#1
Posted 15 June 2004 - 09:32 AM
1. What kind of mortals ? I asked this because Bhaal's Avatar, the Slayer, it's a kind of demon. Did he walk the earth in that form ?
2. The gods took only a mortal form during the Time of Troubles, retaining their powers, or did they lose all their god powers ?
3. How some gods could have been killed during Time of Troubles if they were immortals ? That's a contradiction in terms...
#2
Posted 15 June 2004 - 09:50 AM
Most of them were forced to take over human or demi-human host bodies. Bhaal used several host bodies, but none of them resembled the Slayer.Mates, during the Time of Troubles, gods were forced to walk the earth as mere mortals. I have 3 questions about that :
1. What kind of mortals ? I asked this because Bhaal's Avatar, the Slayer, it's a kind of demon. Did he walk the earth in that form ?
Much of their power was locked away in their home planes, so that they became truly mortal, not gods, but still very powerful mortals. That's the answer to your third question, too.2. The gods took only a mortal form during the Time of Troubles, retaining their powers, or did they lose all their god powers ?
http://www.moveon.org/fox/
"You are what you do. Choose again, and change."
--Cordelia Naismith Vorkosigan
#3
Posted 15 June 2004 - 09:52 AM
Bhaal had the form of a human if I remember correctly.
3. Simple answer: Ao limited their power
I recommend the Avatar Trilogy by Richard Awlinson for reading
Letting you know you're the next one dead
I am the blade that cuts your skin
That forgives yourself for all your sin
I am the guilt that gnaws your soul
Corrodes the heart to a gaping hole
The hammers pounding all around
So you beat the walls to rid the sound
I am your memories, distorted and loud
That make you scream and shreik aloud
Yes, I make you crazy, it's all my fault
That we're here alone in this cushoined vault
#4
Posted 15 June 2004 - 09:53 AM
#5
Posted 15 June 2004 - 09:55 AM
2. They retained only as much power as their mortal shells could contain. So demipowers would have had much closer to their normal amount of powers than greater powers.
3. Gods in the D&Dverse are only immortal in the sense that they will never die by natural causes. Death by violence, magic, etc is another matter. However, dead gods are taken to the astral plane where they become huge, inanimate floating objects. Unless you travel to the astral plane, find the deity's body and somehow permanently destroy it, it's entirely possible that they deity could be resurrected in the future.
Clearly Bhaal went around impregnating women before the Time of Troubles, since during the ToT he didn't 1) have access to enough of his divine essence to create as many spawn as he did, 2) he was too busy looking for the tablets of fate, and 3) he has an adult dragon as a grandson! (dragons taking at least 100 years to reach adulthood)
Edited by NiGHTMARE, 15 June 2004 - 10:00 AM.
#6
Posted 15 June 2004 - 10:26 AM
#7
Posted 15 June 2004 - 10:47 AM
They do have *lots* of divine essence after all, most of which they didn't even have access to during the ToT. For example, during the ToT Mystra retrieved some essence she placed in the realms before she was banished there, thus becoming more powerful than she was supposed to be.
The ToT lasted only a few months. During that time, Bhaal was a bit too busy murdering people to impregnate them .
Edited by NiGHTMARE, 15 June 2004 - 10:48 AM.
#8
Posted 15 June 2004 - 10:53 AM
The Bioware storyline is not official in the FR setting, and was changed many times as BG1 was being put together, changed again in SoA, then changed almost completely in ToB. Bhaal knew that he was going to die, and so planted his seeds long enough ahead of time that a new incarnation would be available when he needed it. Presumeably he didn't know exactly how, and only roughly when. Many of the spawn were alive during the time of troubles, but may not have known what they were.Now i'm immensly confused, he has the kids before the time of troubles? so then they're growing up during it? and how long was it? also why are some of the spawn older than others? Alot of questions, but in so confused.
I'm not sure how long the ToT lasted; I think that Bioware got the dates wrong in a few places.
#9
Posted 15 June 2004 - 11:12 AM
I dare say I'm such a acolyte. I do enjoy reading the "good stuff". Perhaps it is a fantasy addiction in which I'm inexorably forced to satiate my unquenchable appetite.
Nice fix to say the least.
Please.....continue the discussion.........
#10
Posted 15 June 2004 - 11:24 AM
Edited by Ziggy, 15 June 2004 - 11:27 AM.
#11
Posted 15 June 2004 - 11:25 AM
Also, how did the bhaalstuff worked out in the official, non-bioware version of FR?
#12
Posted 15 June 2004 - 11:46 AM
Anyway, this was just the catalyst in a long series of things that gods had been getting up to that were steadily pi**ing Ao off. As punishment, he removed much of their power and banished them all to the surface of Aber-Toril until they recovered the tablets.
He was intending them to work together to retrieve the tablets, but of course they continued their old ways, fighting each other to be the first to retrieve the tablets. In the end the tablets were returned by a group of mortals - Adon, Cyric, Kelemvor and Midnight. The latter three of these were promoted to deities as a reward (though not until some time later in the case of Kelemvor).
Some of the Bhaalspawn stuff is canon, but only that which appears in the novels. If you look on the official FR timeline, you'll see they make an appearance.
Edited by NiGHTMARE, 15 June 2004 - 11:49 AM.
#13
Posted 15 June 2004 - 11:57 AM
Kelemvor became a god years after ToT when he actually freed Te Citty of Dead from Cyric's ruleship.
Letting you know you're the next one dead
I am the blade that cuts your skin
That forgives yourself for all your sin
I am the guilt that gnaws your soul
Corrodes the heart to a gaping hole
The hammers pounding all around
So you beat the walls to rid the sound
I am your memories, distorted and loud
That make you scream and shreik aloud
Yes, I make you crazy, it's all my fault
That we're here alone in this cushoined vault
#14
Posted 15 June 2004 - 12:04 PM
#15
Posted 15 June 2004 - 12:08 PM
In the book he was...well unimportant
"It's Midnight's symbol," Adon replied. "And I swear by its light and the name of Lady Midnight that I'll gather a host of worshipers to honor it!"
Edited by Cyric, 15 June 2004 - 12:11 PM.
Letting you know you're the next one dead
I am the blade that cuts your skin
That forgives yourself for all your sin
I am the guilt that gnaws your soul
Corrodes the heart to a gaping hole
The hammers pounding all around
So you beat the walls to rid the sound
I am your memories, distorted and loud
That make you scream and shreik aloud
Yes, I make you crazy, it's all my fault
That we're here alone in this cushoined vault
#16
Posted 15 June 2004 - 01:05 PM
#17
Posted 15 June 2004 - 01:18 PM
http://www.moveon.org/fox/
"You are what you do. Choose again, and change."
--Cordelia Naismith Vorkosigan
#18
Posted 15 June 2004 - 01:26 PM
Cyric:
"You desired godhood, control over your destiny, and great power," Ao said. "You will have only two of these - godhood and power - to exercise as you will in the Realm of the Dead. And all of the suffering in Toril will be yours as well, to cause and inflict as you wish. But you will never know contentment or happiness again."
Ao paused then and looked at Midnight. "But the thing you have desired most, Lord Cyric, will never come to pass. I am your master now. You serve me... and your worshipers. I believe you will find that you now have less freedom than you had as a child in the alleys of Zhentil Keep."
Midnight:
"You have something that has no place in the Realms," Ao said, pointing a long finger at her.
She immediately knew he meant Mystra's power. "Take it. I have no further use for it."
"Perhaps you do," Ao responded.
"I am too weary for riddles," she snapped.
"I have lost many gods during this crisis," Ao said. "As punishment for their theft, I will leave Bane and Myrkul dispersed. But Mystra, Lady of Mysteries and grantor of magic, is also gone. Even I cannot restore her. Will you take her place?"
Letting you know you're the next one dead
I am the blade that cuts your skin
That forgives yourself for all your sin
I am the guilt that gnaws your soul
Corrodes the heart to a gaping hole
The hammers pounding all around
So you beat the walls to rid the sound
I am your memories, distorted and loud
That make you scream and shreik aloud
Yes, I make you crazy, it's all my fault
That we're here alone in this cushoined vault
#19
Posted 15 June 2004 - 02:20 PM
Interesting that he makes no mention of Bhaal..."I have lost many gods during this crisis," Ao said. "As punishment for their theft, I will leave Bane and Myrkul dispersed."
#20 -Guest-
Posted 15 June 2004 - 02:47 PM
"And Bhaal, that randy bugger, shall be forced to impregnate a chipmunk. . ."Interesting that he makes no mention of Bhaal..."I have lost many gods during this crisis," Ao said. "As punishment for their theft, I will leave Bane and Myrkul dispersed."