61 replies to this topic

[Cryomancer]

I've played through the Baldur's Gate series and both Icewind Dales, and have seen this game a few times but thought it looked kinda weird so I never got it. Is it good? I don't mind about spoilers, because I can usually catch plot twists early on in a game (Melissan didn't fool me a bit...)

[BobTokyo]

Storytelling: 9/10

Dialog: 9/10

Combat: 7/10

Greatest Strengths: Incredibly well done NPCs and setting.

Areas in need of improvement: May not feel like main character really belongs to the Player; may be too text heavy for some player's tastes; combat may start to drag in the maze.

Overall: A few tweaks would have made this my personal favorite IE game; as it is, if you don't mind a protagonist with a back-story almost completely beyond your control and lots of text, this is very, very good game.

[Vlasák]

"...May not feel like main character really belongs to the Player..."

I don't consider the fact that TNO isn't custom character of the player as any disadvantage of Torment. It is true that the character is always male and starts as fighter etc. But these aspects make the gameplay much better. You are the incarnation in TNO body and you have your own freedom - you can do the good acts as well as the evil. And the feeling that you are in "other" body is the exact feeling that you should have

Cryomancer: Torment is really quite different from others games.
1) The plot itself is "little" exotic. You are undead and immortal person without name. Your name is just Nameless one
2) Planescape setting is very different from any other clasical fantasy settings as well. Briefly, it is multiverse that links all possible fantasy worlds - but it has its "own" places (Inner and Outer Planes, Sigil, Ethernal and Astral plane) too. The word, idea and phylosophy has much more power than swords and spells. You can meet deva, werewolf and fiend in one pub and noone will consider it as something odd... You can chat with demons in hell as well as with members of FR gods pantheon in their appropriate planes... Planescape offers *everything*. It is full of bizzare creatures as well as normal humans, elvens, halflings etc. It is full of bizzare planes and places as well as normal areas...

[The Amazing Maurice]

PS:T is like marmite. If you can handle a game that has hardly any combat at all, where intelligence and wisdom are valued more than strength and constitution and the final battle can be fought by using your wit rather than your axe you'll love it.

Pros:

1) A fantastic story & IMHO the greatest story in a game. Ever.
2) The best quality of writing I have ever seen in a game.
3) The most in-depth & unique NPC's in any IE game by far.
4) A unique & dark setting. No lush green plains here.
5) A collection of some of the finest voice acting you will ever hear in a game.
6) A superb soundtrack by Mark Morgan.
7) Alignment & XP rewards for TNO are handled superbly.
Good graphics (Though a little rugged nowadays)
9) Playing as an immortal is different - How many games are there when it can be
beneficial to let yourself be killed?

Cons:

1) A few to many Fed-Ex quests early on
2) Can feel like reading a book sometimes (Though that didn't bother me)
3) It ends.

To put it simply - The greatest RPG ever and one of the great games of all time.

[BobTokyo]

I don't consider the fact that TNO isn't custom character of the player as any disadvantage of Torment. It is true that the character is always male and starts as fighter etc. But these aspects make the gameplay much better. You are the incarnation in TNO body and you have your own freedom - you can do the good acts as well as the evil. And the feeling that you are in "other" body is the exact feeling that you should have

And does it *has* to be a male to fit in the story? Why could not it have been a green-skinned female? Was it that difficult to humour a player just a tiny bit?

I played this game for a couple of hours and got a very negative impression of it. The dialogue was extremely silly and the rigidity of protagonist's gender was absolutely unnesecary imo.

If someone made a mod that tweaked that single aspect that could have made the game so much more playable for me. At its current state it is too frustrating to play.

It's a matter of taste. I like to personalize my characters from the beginning, the more the better. Of course some game designs impose limits on that, and it's easier for the designer to write for a character he or she created, but where possible the player should get a chance to tweak anything not essential to the story. I liked Planescape, but I would have liked it more if I'd had the chance to personalize my character more at the start.

[The Amazing Maurice]

I can see your point about the lack of custimization but you're sacrificing freedom to customize for story & dialouge.

[Vlasák]

And does it *has* to be a male to fit in the story? Why could not it have been a green-skinned female? Was it that difficult to humour a player just a tiny bit?

I played this game for a couple of hours and got a very negative impression of it. The dialogue was extremely silly and the rigidity of protagonist's gender was absolutely unnesecary imo.

If someone made a mod that tweaked that single aspect that could have made the game so much more playable for me. At its current state it is too frustrating to play.

There are some reasons why TNO is a male. I don't want to spoil but - yes, some plof affairs are accurated to male character. And all party members are accurated to male character. Morte would be act totally different if the protagonist will be a female

It's a matter of taste. I like to personalize my characters from the beginning, the more the better. Of course some game designs impose limits on that, and it's easier for the designer to write for a character he or she created, but where possible the player should get a chance to tweak anything not essential to the story. I liked Planescape, but I would have liked it more if I'd had the chance to personalize my character more at the start.

TNO as the fixed protagonist is not because of the fact that the designing will be easier for designers. It is just one of the normal RPG concepts and it is sufficient for Torment's plot.
Yep, it is difference from BG2, for example. In BG2 you can customize your character in many ways. But this customization has almost no effect. Your class is essential just for combats (and stronghold). Your name, your alignment and all customizations play just small role in the whole game as well as your acts itself. You can tell the truth as well as you can lie with any alignment and nothing will happen.
In torment, you have fixed character. But you have freedom to develop it. Each of your acts is counted, everything has own meaning and your companions are sensible to your acts. That is the customization - it is true that I can't play human paladin, but I'm connected with my TNO lawful good incarnation more - my consience is his conscience, NPC are really "live", etc.

[Dalis'ilhea]

I introduced someone to the game a few years ago, he'd had tried playing BgII, but it wasn't for 'im, and he didn't want to play torment because you looked down on the world, but I managed to convince him to play it, I let him borrow my copy, (so it was more or less a demo, my copy is tempermental it sometimes works it sometimes don't you just have to keep playing it till it gives up) and what little he did manage to play made him fall in love with it and had him start hunting for a more reliable copy (funny thing is, I can play it and it works fine anyone else tries and it doesn't like 'em )

ANy way the point is that this particular person doesn't like roleplay games (at all ) but torment had him hooked so yes it is a GOOD game and I'll masticate anyone who says different

oh yeah to all who have played who is this a quote of?

"You have a face only a sledge hammer could love, and HAS!"

I loved that one heh heh

Edited by Dalis'ilhea, 07 June 2004 - 05:01 AM.

[BobTokyo]

TNO as the fixed protagonist is not because of the fact that the designing will be easier for designers. It is just one of the normal RPG concepts and it is sufficient for Torment's plot.

It's a standard device in RPGs because it's easier for the designers, just as the limited effects of your initial customization of your character in the BG games occur because making them count more would have required more time, money and effort from the designers.

[Dalis'ilhea]

The nameless one couldn't be nuetered even if he wanted to, it'd grow back but besides the piont I'll say this

MAYBE A SPOILER MAYBE NOT (i'm not sure)





one of th most important parts of the game involves Ravel a night hag, and they are uniformaly straight (I think I read somewhere that they kill off any who aren't) and she loves the Nameless one, and there are the 'Wreakages' of past relationships still floating about

[Dalis'ilhea]

*grumbles and mutters* stop being arguementative

I've played the game many times and all I can say is that if the Nameless One was female it would have to have a completely different story and it would be a different game al together

[SimDing0]

I *want* to know why he *has* to be a male.

Why should TNO need to have an option to be female, beyond "I don't like playing the opposite sex?" Is it such a stretch of the imagination that he's male?

Edited by SimDing0, 07 June 2004 - 07:49 AM.