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Imoen's sexuality

Started by Quitch, Oct 17 2002 10:50 PM

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528 replies to this topic

#301 -Guest-

Guest

Posted 18 September 2003 - 11:31 PM

To both JPS and Tancred...

I agree with both of your views, it's just that I like to make people give passionate arguments and discussions about most things, including this mod, for which I have been watching on the forums shortly after it's inclusion to the Forgotten Wars Forums.

Although I am a firm believer that one should try their hardest to at least give a variety of options to particular tastes, and not leave anyone out in the cold.

Whatever Quitch makes of this mod, I know and have continuously known, that it will be a thing of beauty, but this mods forum is mostly made up of arguments, and since this topic has been suffering a little downtime, I thought I'd get people arguing. B)

In truth I have been known *unofficially* to have started some of the much longer and bogged down arguments in the past. :ph34r

I have nothing against Quitch or the way business around this forum is done, I just want to remind Quitch, that there a many tastes and views that make up the equation. The more we identify and address the better the mod will be in the end.

To conclude unless Quitch finds a way to stop me from getting access to this mod when it is finished, nothing will stop me from downloading it, installing it, playing it, finishing it, and repeating till I'm old and grey. Because whatever happens this mod's gonna be the best!!!

LSWSjr of LSWSjr Publications/Productions/Studios Australia, signing off

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#302 LSWSjr

Creator of DHSTU

Member
48 posts

Posted 19 September 2003 - 04:34 AM

Well isn't this undignified, LSWSjr posting without his ID, well I never.

Hmm, sorry for that then.

LSWSjr of LSWSjr Publications/Productions/Studios Australia, signing off

[QUOTE]*
In the end, when the chips are down, when you feel like its all over, you have to ask yourself "Was this the right way to be defeated by the inevitable?" and there is only one answer... "It is in this liftime, so I'll see ya in the next, Rowan T. of LSWSjr Publications signing off!"

*Rowan Tritton of LSWSjr Publications/Productions/Studios Australia.

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#303 Longinus

Member
287 posts

Posted 21 September 2003 - 06:08 PM

it's my understanding that Allyson had been (still is?) something of a lesbian icon.

Which is ironic considering she's inflexibly straight.

"If you remember me, then you must also remember what you did!"

~ Edge, Panzer Dragoon Saga

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#304 Littiz

Modder
1078 posts

Posted 21 September 2003 - 11:06 PM

.. and I don't think Viconia has an "icy" face at all.

That’s only ‘cause you have a blue face too! :lol:

Ever forward, my darling wind...

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#305 Tancred

Hapless Paladin

Member
209 posts

Posted 22 September 2003 - 06:08 AM

it's my understanding that Allyson had been (still is?) something of a lesbian icon.
Which is ironic considering she's inflexibly straight.

That's what I thought... *shrug*

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#306 -Cybersquirt-

Guest

Posted 24 September 2003 - 05:29 AM

.. and I don't think Viconia has an "icy" face at all.
That?s only ?cause you have a blue face too!

Viconia's is supposed to be silver.. it's a drow thang.

..anyway.. just because someone is straight doesn't pull them out of the market for fantasy material by any preference. (trying, unsuccessfully, to think of a gay person who's a straight icon) ..and now I wish I knew who you were talking about. I guess the point is that it's all in perception and perception doesn't necessarily have anything to do with reality.

But I would have to agree with an (Quitch's?) original statement - she's got to be something - and, therefore, can't be everything.

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#307 Siegfried

Member
3 posts

Posted 29 September 2003 - 01:49 PM

Hello everyone, I'm new here, and this is my first post

I've read through all the 11 pages off this thread and you guys seem to be switching your focus from time to time

To give my own opinion about the sexuality for Imoen, I tend to agree with those who say that Imoen seems to be the kind of person who falls in love with a person, not in a sex. Therefore, I say bi. I also think bi is good because it adds more variety to the mod in my opinion.
This was a very interesting topic to read, and I think I'm going to like this board. I'm looking forward to this mod and I'll be happy whatever sexual prefernce Imoen will have.
That's my two cents.

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#308 Kish

Member
1265 posts

Posted 29 September 2003 - 04:17 PM

So to conclude, by saying you won't make it so accessible to all players in general,

Accessible to all players in general?

I can't see why Imoen's sexual orientation would have anything to do with my character's ability to develop a deeper relationship with his sister.

http://www.moveon.org/fox/
"You are what you do. Choose again, and change."
--Cordelia Naismith Vorkosigan

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#309 mickeyblueeyessj

Member
34 posts

Posted 07 October 2003 - 05:25 PM

Call me old fashioned but I think of Imoen as straigh up heterosexual.

I always assume people (both real and ficticious) are straight, unless there is evidence stating contrary. According to studies, only 10% of people aren't straight, so it's a pretty safe assumption.

In fiction, i always assume they're are straight because I think that if the authour wanted a character to be gay or bi they would point this out so the reader would know.

Since there isn't evidence of Imoen being gay or bisexual in the games, I don't believe game designers intended her to be.

Of course, according to some of the things I've recently heard, the game designers never intended for Imoen to even be *in* the series.

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#310 Longinus

Member
287 posts

Posted 11 October 2003 - 11:31 AM

I agree: gay people and players are too few for modders to be forced to cater for them and the straight majority.

I still wonder if the Imoen portrayed in the official BG2 novel is the original BioWare character but conveyed through a safer medium.

"If you remember me, then you must also remember what you did!"

~ Edge, Panzer Dragoon Saga

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#311 -Cybersquirt-

Guest

Posted 12 October 2003 - 12:27 AM

I agree: gay people and players are too few for modders to be forced to cater for them and the straight majority.

Forced? That's an interesting choice of words.

Since there isn't evidence of Imoen being gay or bisexual in the games, I don't believe game designers intended her to be.

Name one character, any character, who might be gay in the BG series. I'm willing to bet you won't find "evidence" of anyone being gay.

Where's the in-game 10%? :rolleyes:

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#312 Kish

Member
1265 posts

Posted 12 October 2003 - 12:34 AM

I agree: gay people and players are too few for modders to be forced to cater for them and the straight majority.

That's fatuous. Everyone belongs to some minority; no one is you except you. A modder who dismisses the ideas of people because they belong to a minority will never listen to anyone.

http://www.moveon.org/fox/
"You are what you do. Choose again, and change."
--Cordelia Naismith Vorkosigan

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#313 Longinus

Member
287 posts

Posted 12 October 2003 - 07:37 AM

You can't please everyone and there's an Imoen mod that caters for everyone already almost as if the creator didn't want anyone to miss out on the experience.

"If you remember me, then you must also remember what you did!"

~ Edge, Panzer Dragoon Saga

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#314 Quitch

Perfection

Modder
1132 posts

Posted 13 October 2003 - 02:55 AM

You can't please everyone and there's an Imoen mod that caters for everyone already almost as if the creator didn't want anyone to miss out on the experience.

The experience? Why should there only be one? Say Imoen started as a lesbian, wouldn't that allow for multiple experiences? Other woman could come on to her without fear of a sexuality issue, while men would follow the path of trying to convince her that they can provide as satisfying an experience as any woman.

Why would you simply kill all possible routes because the player hasn't met some requirement of the mod? There should be no requirements, only new possibilities.

Past: Ascension, Return to Windspear, Imoen Relationship, The Broken Hourglass
"Perfection has no deadline"

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#315 -Mikka-

Guest

Posted 13 October 2003 - 09:29 AM

*nod* Just think about it- let's say she was a lesbian.

You could have a female Bhaalspawn try to convince her that she's in the wrong (that it's 'bad' to like woman), you could have a female Bhaalspawn be supportive of her and try to help her find the 'right woman' for her, you could have a female Bhaalspawn also be 'gay' and they could 'scout out' girls together, you could have a female Bhaalspawn also be 'gay' and try to start a relationship with her (which would break in to many other paths as well)...

Then for a male Bhaalspawn, you could have one being supportive and enjoying having a girl who will help them find the 'best chicks' and whatever, you could have a teasing older brother 'can I watch' approch, you could have a 'ew that's so wrong you should be 'normal'' attitude, you could have someone try to change her to set her up with another guy- or even himself- and so on. There's hundreds of different ideas you could play around with.

It's not like there's a rock there blocking you from trying. At least from what I'm understanding, it's not like her sexuality is the focus of the mod, anyway. Just a detail in making her more 'real'.

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#316 Longinus

Member
287 posts

Posted 13 October 2003 - 09:52 AM

You can't please everyone and there's an Imoen mod that caters for everyone already almost as if the creator didn't want anyone to miss out on the experience.
The experience? Why should there only be one? Say Imoen started as a lesbian, wouldn't that allow for multiple experiences? Other woman could come on to her without fear of a sexuality issue, while men would follow the path of trying to convince her that they can provide as satisfying an experience as any woman.

Why would you simply kill all possible routes because the player hasn't met some requirement of the mod? There should be no requirements, only new possibilities.

I'm simply saying that a romance mod shouldn't have to cater for every conceivable sexual preference.

"If you remember me, then you must also remember what you did!"

~ Edge, Panzer Dragoon Saga

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#317 Quitch

Perfection

Modder
1132 posts

Posted 14 October 2003 - 12:51 PM

If you mean in so far as the character concerned should be romancable by all comers, then I agree. If you mean in so far as the character concerned should react to all comers, then I disagree.

Past: Ascension, Return to Windspear, Imoen Relationship, The Broken Hourglass
"Perfection has no deadline"

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#318 -Cybersquirt-

Guest

Posted 14 October 2003 - 06:00 PM

You can't please everyone and there's an Imoen mod that caters for everyone already almost as if the creator didn't want anyone to miss out on the experience.

IMO he wrote Imoen the way he saw her -- he had her willing to romance the PC, whomever that was, so long as they weren't an ass (but that's got nothing to do with this topic, really). So you're saying that just because it's been done before (it, being that Imoen would romance females) it can't be done again? I'm quite sure Quitch and Mirrabbo are 2 different people with different styles and different viewpoints, how drastic remains to be seen; so they will be 2 different mods based on that alone.

I realize that no matter what one does or how things get handled, there's going to be someone out there who doesn't like it -- I was questioning your use of the word "forced"; as if someone, in your opinion, was "forced" to cater to "them". ..and I'm left wondering who that might be; or, perhaps, you're worried that Quitch will be "forced" to cater to "them".

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#319 mickeyblueeyessj

Member
34 posts

Posted 15 October 2003 - 06:16 PM

Since there isn't evidence of Imoen being gay or bisexual in the games, I don't believe game designers intended her to be.
Name one character, any character, who might be gay in the BG series. I'm willing to bet you won't find "evidence" of anyone being gay.

Where's the in-game 10%?

The in game 10% is Anomen. Sure it's only one character out of a whole bunch of characters, but Anomen's gay factor makes up the difference.

There is evidence to support Anomen being gay.

He fits a few of the gay sterotypes, and if you're going to create a fictional character who's gay, but not coe right out and ay he's gay, you have to play the sterotypes to make people catch on.

For example, no self respecting straight male would pick the colour choices for clothing that Anomen did, because they wouldn't feel like dealing with the constant gay jokes people would be making about them.

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#320 Laufey

Modder
1245 posts

Posted 15 October 2003 - 07:30 PM

Since there isn't evidence of Imoen being gay or bisexual in the games, I don't believe game designers intended her to be.
Name one character, any character, who might be gay in the BG series. I'm willing to bet you won't find "evidence" of anyone being gay.

Where's the in-game 10%?
The in game 10% is Anomen. Sure it's only one character out of a whole bunch of characters, but Anomen's gay factor makes up the difference.

There is evidence to support Anomen being gay.

He fits a few of the gay sterotypes, and if you're going to create a fictional character who's gay, but not coe right out and ay he's gay, you have to play the sterotypes to make people catch on.

For example, no self respecting straight male would pick the colour choices for clothing that Anomen did, because they wouldn't feel like dealing with the constant gay jokes people would be making about them.

This is Faerun, remember? Who says those color choices would cause 'gay jokes' there? Also, given that Anomen is the one male romance partner kept as an official romance, I would say there is no other male in the game *less* likely to have secretly been thought gay by the developers. Not sure which the other stereotypes you referred to are, but stereotypes, after all, are just that.

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