360 replies to this topic

[jastey]

What I said was a mere principle thing - I wouldn't play a mod like that. Still, The Sandrah Saga has moments like that, where PC romancing NPCs are more than overwhelmed by Sandrah to a point where they forget who they are actually romancing. I thought it's a concept of Sandrah. If it is, there would be a discrepancy between the NPCs losing their head but the PC staying totally focused. If it makes sense.

 

I am *all* with you concerning choices, and not railroading the PC into what he is thinking/feeling/doing. It's one of the basic concepts a good mod needs.

[Barachiel]

I have a question, I usually use BWS for my mod installing needs.  However, I've given the Readme PDF a good once-over, and it looks like to me, given how high Sandrah is in it's load order, that letting BWS install it would be a massive mistake.  Am I correct?  Is there some way to make BWS install it in the readme-recommended load order? 

[Roxanne]

I have a question, I usually use BWS for my mod installing needs.  However, I've given the Readme PDF a good once-over, and it looks like to me, given how high Sandrah is in it's load order, that letting BWS install it would be a massive mistake.  Am I correct?  Is there some way to make BWS install it in the readme-recommended load order? 

In the BWS menu, mods are ordered by categories for easier selection (so she is under *Big Mods*). This is NOT the install order. No need to worry, BWS does it correctly.

[Barachiel]

I have a question, I usually use BWS for my mod installing needs.  However, I've given the Readme PDF a good once-over, and it looks like to me, given how high Sandrah is in it's load order, that letting BWS install it would be a massive mistake.  Am I correct?  Is there some way to make BWS install it in the readme-recommended load order? 

In the BWS menu, mods are ordered by categories for easier selection (so she is under *Big Mods*). This is NOT the install order. No need to worry, BWS does it correctly.

Ah!  TIL.   I thought since I saw things like SCS broken up between multiple categories that it actually installed things in stages.  Thank you for the quick reply.  Looks like I'll be giving Sandrah a try after all. ^-^

[Roxanne]

I have a question, I usually use BWS for my mod installing needs.  However, I've given the Readme PDF a good once-over, and it looks like to me, given how high Sandrah is in it's load order, that letting BWS install it would be a massive mistake.  Am I correct?  Is there some way to make BWS install it in the readme-recommended load order? 

In the BWS menu, mods are ordered by categories for easier selection (so she is under *Big Mods*). This is NOT the install order. No need to worry, BWS does it correctly.

Ah!  TIL.   I thought since I saw things like SCS broken up between multiple categories that it actually installed things in stages.  Thank you for the quick reply.  Looks like I'll be giving Sandrah a try after all. ^-^

SCS and some other mods consist of multiple components that may be individually selected. Some appear in more than one category since their components do quite different things.

The way the later install is performed is independent of that. In case you want to see sequence, take a look at the file *select.txt* in the config folder of the respective game,

[Barachiel]

Ack i got logged out. 

 

EDIT:  I've been reading through the entire thread, and the NToSC question got answered.

 

I see where the XP reduction option is mentioned as being default in a BWS installation, but I think this got turned off, because the EETweaks option isn't enabled, and I didn't see a counterpart in aTweaks or Tweaks Anthology.  Am I overlooking it, or is it enabled elsewhere, and I should leave things alone?

Edited by Barachiel, 13 September 2017 - 07:34 AM.

[Roxanne]

Ack i got logged out. 

 

EDIT:  I've been reading through the entire thread, and the NToSC question got answered.

 

I see where the XP reduction option is mentioned as being default in a BWS installation, but I think this got turned off, because the EETweaks option isn't enabled, and I didn't see a counterpart in aTweaks or Tweaks Anthology.  Am I overlooking it, or is it enabled elsewhere, and I should leave things alone?

EETweaks was updated with new and better components just recently. Thus there are no defaults selected in BWS for it. There is just not sufficient experience yet for a solid recommendation. My own choice would be to select a 50% reduction for what EETweaks offers.

[Barachiel]

Alright.  I'll consider it.  I didn't enable it in the initial installation setup, but I should be able to install EE_Tweaks separately after BWS is done without too much trouble.

 

Is the XP cap still 8 million with no other limitations due to story?  I saw the thread over on G3 where the debate was going on, but it was an older thread and I couldn't find documenation that answered one way or another. 

 

Why do I get the feeling I should be over in the support thread? That's my last question as far as setup goes, I swear on the great god, Beginagain. 

Edited by Barachiel, 13 September 2017 - 09:55 AM.

[Barachiel]

Sorry, back for a non-tech support related question.

 

My party is full up and keep meeting these new extra party members I want to try.  Jen'lig really doesn't have a place with my Mage/Thief Imoen.  When I remove her, she appears to vanish all together.  How much am I screwing over the Sandrah storyline if I kick her to the curb, and is there a chance to pick her back up later?

[Roxanne]

Sorry, back for a non-tech support related question.

 

My party is full up and keep meeting these new extra party members I want to try.  Jen'lig really doesn't have a place with my Mage/Thief Imoen.  When I remove her, she appears to vanish all together.  How much am I screwing over the Sandrah storyline if I kick her to the curb, and is there a chance to pick her back up later?

Jen'lig has her very own story line, you do not need her for the Sandrah plot. When you do not take her, she solves her mission on her own and may cross your path again (but not join you), Also, she will bot appear in ToB if you did not have her in BG1. You can treat her like an NPV from an independent mod.

 

[Barachiel]

Jen'lig has her very own story line, you do not need her for the Sandrah plot. When you do not take her, she solves her mission on her own and may cross your path again (but not join you), Also, she will bot appear in ToB if you did not have her in BG1. You can treat her like an NPV from an independent mod.

 

Wonderful!  Thank you.

[datachild]

Hi Roxanne, during my last instalation I had the following problem (without any idea how to fix it):
 

 

 

### 0005: SandrahNPC Creatures and Items ###
Ready for installation
Setup-SandrahNPC.exe --no-exit-pause --noautoupdate --language 0 --skip-at-view --force-install-list 5 --logapp
[Setup-SandrahNPC.exe] WeiDU version 24200
Using Language [English]

Using .\lang\en_us\dialog.tlk

Installing [SandrahNPC Creatures and Items] [v2.05]
Copying and patching 1 file ...
ERROR: cannot convert %CVMystra% or %%CVMystra%% to an integer
ERROR: [SandrahNPC\CRE/Sandrah.cre] -> [override\Sandrah.cre] Patching Failed (COPY) (Not_found)
Stopping installation because of error.

ERROR Installing [SandrahNPC Creatures and Items], rolling back to previous state
Will uninstall 0 files for [SANDRAHNPC/SETUP-SANDRAHNPC.TP2] component 5.
Uninstalled 0 files for [SANDRAHNPC/SETUP-SANDRAHNPC.TP2] component 5.
ERROR: Not_found
PLEASE email the file SETUP-SANDRAHNPC.DEBUG to Roxanne - Send PM to Roxanne at SHSForums.net
Automatically Skipping [SandrahNPC Creatures and Items] because of error.
Using Language [English]

NOT INSTALLED DUE TO ERRORS SandrahNPC Creatures and Items

Attached Files

•  BiG World Install Debug.txt   15.98MB   274 downloads

Edited by datachild, 01 October 2017 - 12:31 PM.

[Roxanne]

Hi Roxanne, during my last instalation I had the following problem (without any idea how to fix it):
 

 

 

### 0005: SandrahNPC Creatures and Items ###
Ready for installation
Setup-SandrahNPC.exe --no-exit-pause --noautoupdate --language 0 --skip-at-view --force-install-list 5 --logapp
[Setup-SandrahNPC.exe] WeiDU version 24200
Using Language [English]

Using .\lang\en_us\dialog.tlk

Installing [SandrahNPC Creatures and Items] [v2.05]
Copying and patching 1 file ...
ERROR: cannot convert %CVMystra% or %%CVMystra%% to an integer
ERROR: [SandrahNPC\CRE/Sandrah.cre] -> [override\Sandrah.cre] Patching Failed (COPY) (Not_found)
Stopping installation because of error.

ERROR Installing [SandrahNPC Creatures and Items], rolling back to previous state
Will uninstall 0 files for [SANDRAHNPC/SETUP-SANDRAHNPC.TP2] component 5.
Uninstalled 0 files for [SANDRAHNPC/SETUP-SANDRAHNPC.TP2] component 5.
ERROR: Not_found
PLEASE email the file SETUP-SANDRAHNPC.DEBUG to Roxanne - Send PM to Roxanne at SHSForums.net
Automatically Skipping [SandrahNPC Creatures and Items] because of error.
Using Language [English]

NOT INSTALLED DUE TO ERRORS SandrahNPC Creatures and Items

It is most likely this issue caused by some mod installed prior to Sandrah (e.g. ESxKit from Eilistraee mod in your case). It can happen in large installs to any mod that adds a custom kit to the game by an outdated method. Below link has a solution for it:

http://www.shsforums...-37#entry596924

Edited by Roxanne, 01 October 2017 - 12:56 PM.

[Roxanne]

Thank Roxanne for your very quick reply. I will try to describe the way I proceeded:

 

1 First I reinstalled via BWS without the Eilistraee mod you suggested. Sadly I ran into the same error as before, suggesting that Eilistrae is at least not the only problem (if at all).

2.1 According to the earlier solution you described, I manually uninstalled SandraNPC and reinstalled component 1-5, with the option to ask for every component. The Manual installation ran perfectly to this point.

2.2. Changing back to BWS I quit the manual installation and told BWS to continue. BWS provided the next error regarding a problem that some components have to be installed all at once. This time BWS only provided the option to skip the component.

3.1. I switched back to manual installation again, uninstalled SandraNPC and could again successfully install the package (this time the whole component, without asking for single components).

3.2. Back to BWS, I told BWS to skip

4. It seems that BWS registered the manual installation an continued with the next packages.

 

I was wondering regarding the issue in 2.2. In the beginning I told BWS not to install the different components in batches, because that lead to memory issues during the installation of SCS. But SandraNPC seems to be designed to be installed in one go, as far as I understood the error message? In this case could it be that by deselecting the batch installation of BWS I messed up the install procedure of SandraNPC, thereby producing my initial bug?

Or is SandraNPC designed to work, if I skip some/many of the subcomponents of this mod?

The only reason for Sandrah to have components at all is to easier find errors and solve problems. For a successful installation, all components are required. If you skip one during install, the remainder will fail. This is said in the mod description but maybe you did not notice it. The main reason for the subcomponents is not to have to install all the area and item stuff at the beginning just in case there is a late error in some dialogue compile. But contentswise, Sandrah NPC is one big block. The optional components are found by the mod itself by looking for other files/mods in your install and either adding or skipping contents.

Hope your issue is solved now,

[datachild]

Hi Roxane, thank you again for clarification. The issue is solved for me (or more accurately I have a workaround thanks to you).

 

Your explanation only enforces my believe that the error was produced by the BWS-option to avoid installing mods in a batch, not actually another mod by itself. With this flag disabled the mods seems to be installed one component at a time. According to you (and your manual ) this is not possible for Sandrah. While this is not directly your problem (since you clearly stated this in the manual) may I nevertheless respectfully suggest to provide a solution for installations via BWS with this flag disabled? I for myself don't read install instructions for individual mods when relying on BWS. In my case a valid solution for a problem (in the context of BWS - memory issues in scs) directly lead to errors during the installation of your mod. 

 

As an argument (besides my personal feelings and stupidity) please consider the following points:

- The no batch option is a valid option in BWS, other people could (or even must) use this for different reasons. All would have problems with your mods installation if I'm right.

- While I see your point in keeping separated components for debugging and support purposes it seems to me that this is a non compliant use for components in the installation (and thus the problems in BWS)

- Lastly for me as an user it isn't very intuitive to provide these options in the first place even though they are never meant to be opt-out.

 

TLDR; If at all possible, please provide a BWS-friendly version of the mod that considers the BWS option to not install mods in batches.

Edited by datachild, 02 October 2017 - 07:14 AM.

[Roxanne]

TLDR; If at all possible, please provide a BWS-friendly version of the mod that considers the BWS option to not install mods in batches.

Thanks for taking the trouble of this detailed description.

I am not sure if that BWS function is really the issue here.

- I have seen the similar error

ERROR: cannot convert %blabla% or %%blabla%% to an integer

in many installations (manual or BWS) and for many other mods as well, always relating to the kit the respective mod tries to apply to the NPC cre file.

 

- "a non compliant use for components in the installation" - I cannot see this statement applicable. Many mods have components where one component requires the previous one to be installed. What is non-compliant about that? What is meant by "BWS-friendly version"

 

- in case there is really a relation between the mod and the BWS batch function, it is my understanding that this would require some extra code in BWS rather than in the mod itself, using maybe BWS'

GRP;Start
...
GRP;Stop

according to https://htmlpreview....p/Docs/faq.htm?

 

This may be subject to further investigation. If found true, it probably applies to a number of other mods as well.

 

provide a solution for installations via BWS with this flag disabled

What is the "flag" you talk about here? I never saw this mentioned anywhere?

Edited by Roxanne, 02 October 2017 - 08:41 AM.

[datachild]

provide a solution for installations via BWS with this flag disabled

What is the "flag" you talk about here? I never saw this mentioned anywhere?

 

If I'm not mistaken, the flag/option I'm talking about in BWS is called GroupInstall (set via GUI) and I think it somehow corresponds to the batch-mode described in your link. Maybe the problem lies indeed with BWS, I don't know enough about the internal code structure of BWS and WeiDU to answer this. If you are right then it would be indeed BWSs problem.

 

The "non-compliance" wasn't meant as an offence but an expression of my understanding about the structure of "optional" components. You are right of cause that there are dependencies. But my understanding was that each component within one package had only dependencies regarding components installed before (past dependencies) and does not enforce the installation of another component after the current one (future dependencies) (within the package). Then again I'm no modder, so I withdraw my statement if this is not the case.

Edited by datachild, 02 October 2017 - 10:04 AM.

[Roxanne]

The "non-compliance" wasn't meant as an offence but an expression of my understanding about the structure of "optional" components. You are right of cause that there are dependencies. But my understanding was that each component within one package had only dependencies regarding components installed before (past dependencies) and does not enforce the installation of another component after the current one (future dependencies) (within the package). Then again I'm no modder, so I withdraw my statement if this is not the case.

As far as Weidu and weidu based mods are concerned, something like "future dependencies"c is not supported,independent on how you install it, manually or via BWS. Weidu can only append/modify files that are already there. If a file requires multiple operations by a mod, those are done sequentially. In this aspect the components in my mods are building steps, where one component adds to the previous one or to other existing game resources. This is not different from other mods in the game.

 

Maybe someone with better knowledge about BWS can help here. But like I stated before, I have seen numerous cases of that kit related error even from much smaller mods and even from mods with a single component only.