1095 replies to this topic

[Roxanne]

Im not that skilled in BG modding so i dont know what to look for...so i will have to rely on you (sorry for that) SanArmM and SanAmul are among those that are not working...strangely enough Sanwdsty works.

Nothing has changed those items - so another source of error eliminated.

 

This only leaves the global files (2da's) which control the weapons, equipment, etc use for different classes and kits. So I am back to the earlier assumption that something in the recently updated mods has changed in a way that affects Sandrah to make her unusable.

 

I am sorry to say that I have no solution for it at this moment. This is a bit like finding a needle in a haystack unless you are familiar with each of those mods down to coding level. However, I do not even have those updated versions installed myself at the moment, so I cannot even identify which files they change...

In an earlier post you said:

 

i game her thief ability to use all items

This will work, if you can forgive her - and not misuse - so unrealistic advantages. I am curious how or why Sandrah could be the only NPC suffering from those issues, which are clearly not a bug from my mod itself.

 

One last thing, just in case you still have it, could you please post SETUP-SANDRAHNPC.DEBUG from your BG2EE folder?

Edited by Roxanne, 20 August 2017 - 09:43 AM.

[miker17]

Im not that skilled in BG modding so i dont know what to look for...so i will have to rely on you (sorry for that) SanArmM and SanAmul are among those that are not working...strangely enough Sanwdsty works.

Nothing has changed those items - so another source of error eliminated.

 

This only leaves the global files (2da's) which control the weapons, equipment, etc use for different classes and kits. So I am back to the earlier assumption that something in the recently updated mods has changed in a way that affects Sandrah to make her unusable.

 

I am sorry to say that I have no solution for it at this moment. This is a bit like finding a needle in a haystack unless you are familiar with each of those mods down to coding level. However, I do not even have those updated versions installed myself at the moment, so I cannot even identify which files they change...

In an earlier post you said:

 

i game her thief ability to use all items

This will work, if you can forgive her - and not misuse - so unrealistic advantages. I am curious how or why Sandrah could be the only NPC suffering from those issues, which are clearly not a bug from my mod itself.

 

One last thing, just in case you still have it, could you please post SETUP-SANDRAHNPC.DEBUG from your BG2EE folder?

 

Sure here it is....

Attached Files

•  SETUP-SANDRAHNPC.DEBUG   1.68MB   278 downloads

[Roxanne]

Sure here it is....

If you are still willing to help me find the possible source of that issue...

 

In your override folder may be a file *d5_usabl.2da*, If yes, could you post it as well?

[miker17]

Here (had to put it in rar because for some reason Im not permitted to upload this kind of files)

Attached Files

•  d5_usabl.rar   1.5K   146 downloads

Edited by miker17, 20 August 2017 - 11:01 AM.

[Roxanne]

Here (had to put it in rar because for some reason Im not permitted to upload this kind of files)

 

Thank you once more.

 

This is like Sherlock Holmes - when you eliminated all other possibilities, what remains must be the truth.

 

Only problem in this case is that it does not help me at this time. Not until I finished my current project and do a complete new re-install with latest version of two mods. Since they stopped documenting their changes long ago, there is no way for me to trace this without having them installed.

[franco8737]

I used to encounter this item unusable problem, and with my last installation, I unchecked Scale of Balance and Faiths and Powers, the problem is gone. But I can see miker17 didn't install these mod.

[subtledoctor]

Some time ago I did an install with a big number of mods, including Sandrah, SOB, Item Revisions and FnP.

I think this is the issue. The recent, extensive update to FnP made changes that affect its compatibility with a couple other mods. In the case of Sandrah, it means the compatibility patch had to be updated... I supplied the new one to Sandrah. If someone installed within the couple days when things were not in sync, there might be usability issues. But I believe they are gone now.

Like Sandrah, one of sob's components needs an update as well, and Real Life has prevented me from finding the time to do it. For the moment, I would avoid using SoB component #122 with FnP. I'll sort it out soon...

By the way let's be clear, while component 122 reduces NPCs' level to 1, it does not change their XP, so they should level up to their normal level immediately upon joining the party. If that causes problems anywhere, as always, people should say so.

I used to encounter this item unusable problem, and with my last installation, I unchecked Scale of Balance and Faiths and Powers, the problem is gone. But I can see miker17 didn't install these mod.

That is telling...

Sandrah, if you see any incompatibilities or see an instance where a mod requires use of the console, can you please report it in mod's development thread rather than just silently marking it expert?? Please, please, let's treat each other with a bit of respect.

Importantly, SoB's readme very clearly states that each and every component is independent of all the others - they are like many different independent mods, so a compatibility issue with one component does not mean you should condemn any of the other components.

Editorially, you are extremely quick to condemn other mods while extolling the perfection of your own... I wish you could be more communicative and supportive, instead of dismissive. Your threads here are rifewoth reports of bugs in your mod... which you then quickly fix. No mod is perfect. Please afford other modders the ability to react to players on the same way.

More specifically, consider a mod that imposes DEX penalties when wearing heavy armor... like, say, Item Revisions. (I notice you did not mark IR or FPPS as expert for interfering with your mod... only mine.) If your mod adds a pair of boots or something that requires 16 DEX, and my mod gives a -3 DEX penalty to plate mail... that is not actually an incompatibility. If a player can see those effects and decides to install them together and live with the consequences, what is the problem? Unless of course you don't make the stat requirement clear in the item description, or something... in which case I think you should.

More generally, you seems to be on a campaign to marginalize my mods and hide them from players who might enjoy them. I will be the first to admit my code can be improved, and I am more than willing to work with other modders to do so. For the life of me I can't figure out why you are so resistant to discussing and solving issues that arise...

[Roxanne]

I think this is the issue. The recent, extensive update to FnP made changes that affect its compatibility with a couple other mods. In the case of Sandrah, it means the compatibility patch had to be updated... I supplied the new one to Sandrah. If someone installed within the couple days when things were not in sync, there might be usability issues. But I believe they are gone now.

 

This is exactly what my analysis of the issues reported here on this thread confirms. With both mods updated and synchronised, I can see no compatibility issue. The data provided here http://www.shsforums...36#entry596709, makes it clear that the issue is with some other mod.

 

SoB components 121 and 122 were found to have some issues with several mod NPCs. It is not exceptional that reports are first made for Sandrah - simply because in an EET game she is usually the first mod NPC with custom equipment/kit whom a player can meet. Some further research has shown, that those components are affecting a number of other mods as well. Sometimes a part of it is solved by level up process, but not all of it.

 

With respect to Item Revision, I have a suspicion that the latest updates may create either issues or incompatibilities with some other mods, but I cannot identify it yet. I tried to explain this here:

Only problem in this case is that it does not help me at this time. Not until I finished my current project and do a complete new re-install with latest version of two mods. Since they stopped documenting their changes long ago, there is no way for me to trace this without having them installed.

 

With regards to Sandrah mod itself - the mod has been in BWS *Expert* category ever since EET started and was only upgraded quite recently with having reached a stable status. Sadly this has now been lost again by mayor updates of other big mods that ripple back again.

 

I spend a lot of time with detecting issues best that I can that are to a large extend not bugs of my own mods. Large modded installs are a difficult construction and with EET we have just started what took years back in BGT, i.e. detecting dependencies and conflicts and starting to establish an install sequence. I am not throwing stones at anyone, I try to identify and help solve problems.

 

It has become a very bad habit on this forum and on G3 to behead the messenger for bringing bad news.

[subtledoctor]

I am not throwing stones at anyone, I try to identify and help solve problems.

Then why is a random visit to this thread the first I'm hearing about this:

SoB components 121 and 122 were found to have some issues with several mod NPCs.

Found when? Which mods NPCs? What kind of "issues," exactly? If there are issues, they are certainly fixable... so why not identify and call attention to the issues, so that they can be fixed?

You said mods should be marked as expert if they require use of the console to advance... well I play with my mods on an iPad and there is no console. So... it doesn't seem to be the case. What is the issue that you have identified that you think requires this action?

Btw I think you are wrong about the Haiass thing... none of my mods affect scripts at all to my knowledge, so I don't know how they could affect the AI behavior of a creature like that. Though, as always, I am certainly willing to check for an unforeseen bug or typo, and fix it... if given the chance.

[Roxanne]

Facts

 

Following (in EET) mods are currently expert status:

- RoT (new EE version, just released) because it needs further consolidation

- Drake NPC (by request of the author, deemed still experimental)

- BP Series Party AI

- Divine Remix

- Refinements

Which one of those is your mod?

 

(Those mods have a red indication in the selection screen at all times, other mods may turn red if you selected a conflicting combination, but only then.)

 

Then why is a random visit to this thread the first I'm hearing about this:

Those users who encountered the problems reported on this thread here. We did an analysis and collected facts and found that the problem was not with Sandrah.

Like I pointed out already, many reports are made here that have nothing to do with my mod just because my NPC is the first indicator for many problems.

 

In order to track some problems reported here, I had to do an intermediate install of SoB for analysis. During this I found a lot of other problems but I did not take the time for deeper search at the current stage of that mod, understanding that it is still under construction.

 

The SoB issue with mod NPCs and their equipment was a random find during above analysis (Chloe, Yasraena, Amber to name some). It was just to check that the issue was not for Sandrah only. This was not beta-testing the mod but a side effect while looking at possible Sandrah bugs. This is the information I have and the information I share, those are random findings while looking at something else. Find them helpful or not, they are not intended as bug reports for your mods (it would be up to those who reported the original issue to come up with that, nor the task of a third party.)

Edited by Roxanne, 21 August 2017 - 11:52 AM.

[subtledoctor]

On another note, I just saw that you turned nearly every component of SoB to expert.

Concerning SoB, marking it expert is always required if a mod makes it necessary to revert to console or use a game editor when installed.

Facts

mods are currently expert status:
- RoT / Drake NPC / BP Series / Divine Remix / Refinements

I can only go by your own posts, which seem to contradict each other. I don't know which is the case. But, you suggested earlier that a mod requires the console or a game editor, which does not in any way require the console or a game editor. That is wrong.

The SoB issue with mod NPCs and their equipment was a random find during above analysis (Chloe, Yasraena, Amber to name some)

What issue? You suggest there is an "issue" but you still have not described it. If there is an issue, again, please state it plainly so that it can be fixed. I don't understand this need to be coy, suggesting other mods have problems but then refusing to back it up with real observations.

[subtledoctor]

Anyway, on a more productive note, I have created a hotfix for anyone experiencing armor usability issues with Sandrah (or any other cleric kit/NPC) and FnP, I have made a hotfix, here:

 

https://forums.beamd...#Comment_898954

 

The hotfix will make sure that each cleric kit gets the proper kit usability flag, based on whether it sets the CHAIN_ARMOR and PLATE_ARMOR variables to 1 or 0.  The latest upload of FnP (0.74i) includes the fix.  The hotfix can be applied at the end of your load order, and I think on games in progress as well.  This means that any usability issues will not be a matter of whether a kit has the right flag, but only whether a given item is set to be usable by that flag.  Which is super easy to address, so anyone with such issues, let us know.

 

Also Roxanne, I have once again edited the FnP compatibility package, and I once again hope it is for the last time.  I'm attaching it, and it can also be found in the FnP mod itself, in the "other mods" subdirectory.  This does not require you to change anything, only to drop this new version of 'fnp_compat.tpa' into the /lib directory.

 

Cheers.

Attached Files

•  FnP_kit_compatibility.zip   10.65K   140 downloads

[Roxanne]

Also Roxanne, I have once again edited the FnP compatibility package, and I once again hope it is for the last time.  I'm attaching it, and it can also be found in the FnP mod itself, in the "other mods" subdirectory.  This does not require you to change anything, only to drop this new version of 'fnp_compat.tpa' into the /lib directory.

 

Cheers.

Updated my mod with it.

 

One other thing I noticed in SoB is that it tries to identify joinable NPCs by the SOUND BIOS field (at least this is how I interpret the code?). There was a mod in the past which tried that as well (cannot remember or find which mod it was) but the method has issues. Not every joinable NPC has a bio and on the other hand there are non-joinable NPCs with contents in that fiield. No idea why that is, maybe NPCs were created from copies of joinable NPCs and some joinable NPCs from copies of others, one can only guess.)

[subtledoctor]

Yeah. I got that technique from one of the more established mods - I forget which one, maybe RR or BG2Tweaks or something else that has been around for many many years - so I assumed it was well-tested and valid. I guess that wSn't a great assumption.

Every mod NPC I've encountered has a string in their biography field, so I don't think there are any false negatives (except one of the Garrick variants in BGEE, specifically GARRIC4.cre, a bug which I've reported to Beamdog). But someone just made me aware of some false positives - non-joinable NPCs with biography strrefs, which is silly because you'll never read those strrefs if they can't join - in the Dark Horizons mod.

That being one of the old "mega" mods that are not being updated, I don't see those NPCs getting fixed anytime soon. So I'll look into finding another way to do it. Maybe there is a more direct way... every joinable NPC has a .dlg file with a 'JoinParty' script action somewhere in it, right? Maybe I can check every .dlg file for that regexp, make a list of the ones that return true, and then run through that list and find which .cre files refer to any of those dialogues. Make a list of the ones that return true, and there is the list of all joinable NPCs. Right?

Or, are you aware of any other, simpler differences between joinable NPCs and AI NPCs? Something to check in the .cre file?

An alternate method is to simply keep a list of NPCs that have biographies, but are not joinable. It's only a handful, after all.

It will take me a while to figure out the best method. In the meantime, this is a conflict between SoB comp #122 and the Dark Horizons mod.

[subtledoctor]

By the way, as regards to NPCs' items and stat requirements: if you are using stat requirements as a hidden way to make items usable only by your NPC - the way BG2/TOB did it originally - then you might be interested to know that there is a better method now, which could work for your mod as it is meant for use with the EE 2.0+ engine.  Opcode 319 in equipping effects generally prohibits classes of people from using the item.  However, it can also do the opposite.  If you set Parameter2 to 11 ("actor's script name") and then set the script name (the 8-byte offset after Probability2) to your NPC's script name, then the effect will reverse itself, allowing your NPC to use the item, and prohibiting everyone else from using it.

 

The IESDP completely fails to communicate this, so many modders don't realize it.

Edited by subtledoctor, 23 August 2017 - 06:18 PM.

[franco8737]

Some time ago I did an install with a big number of mods, including Sandrah, SOB, Item Revisions and FnP.

I think this is the issue. The recent, extensive update to FnP made changes that affect its compatibility with a couple other mods. In the case of Sandrah, it means the compatibility patch had to be updated... I supplied the new one to Sandrah. If someone installed within the couple days when things were not in sync, there might be usability issues. But I believe they are gone now.

Like Sandrah, one of sob's components needs an update as well, and Real Life has prevented me from finding the time to do it. For the moment, I would avoid using SoB component #122 with FnP. I'll sort it out soon...

By the way let's be clear, while component 122 reduces NPCs' level to 1, it does not change their XP, so they should level up to their normal level immediately upon joining the party. If that causes problems anywhere, as always, people should say so.

I used to encounter this item unusable problem, and with my last installation, I unchecked Scale of Balance and Faiths and Powers, the problem is gone. But I can see miker17 didn't install these mod.

That is telling...

Sandrah, if you see any incompatibilities or see an instance where a mod requires use of the console, can you please report it in mod's development thread rather than just silently marking it expert?? Please, please, let's treat each other with a bit of respect.

Importantly, SoB's readme very clearly states that each and every component is independent of all the others - they are like many different independent mods, so a compatibility issue with one component does not mean you should condemn any of the other components.

Editorially, you are extremely quick to condemn other mods while extolling the perfection of your own... I wish you could be more communicative and supportive, instead of dismissive. Your threads here are rifewoth reports of bugs in your mod... which you then quickly fix. No mod is perfect. Please afford other modders the ability to react to players on the same way.

More specifically, consider a mod that imposes DEX penalties when wearing heavy armor... like, say, Item Revisions. (I notice you did not mark IR or FPPS as expert for interfering with your mod... only mine.) If your mod adds a pair of boots or something that requires 16 DEX, and my mod gives a -3 DEX penalty to plate mail... that is not actually an incompatibility. If a player can see those effects and decides to install them together and live with the consequences, what is the problem? Unless of course you don't make the stat requirement clear in the item description, or something... in which case I think you should.

More generally, you seems to be on a campaign to marginalize my mods and hide them from players who might enjoy them. I will be the first to admit my code can be improved, and I am more than willing to work with other modders to do so. For the life of me I can't figure out why you are so resistant to discussing and solving issues that arise...

 

These generalized accusations are not true. I do not intend "to be on a campaign to marginalize" your mods.

 

On the contrary, I am your constant supporter and tester because I used to install your mod (SoB, FnP, MnG) with BG2EE and it works really fine and I love them. Unfortunately, it seems that the things not going very fine in EET and I am not familiar with those technical things, the only way I can play the game smoothly is to get rid of the mods that cause incompatibilities until they are stable.

 

I tried re-install the whole EET with countless times and each time I hope all mods work fine with each other. 

Edited by franco8737, 23 August 2017 - 10:58 PM.

[subtledoctor]

Franco8737 that wasn't talking about you. You are indeed an excellent supporter and tester (and hopefully you have fun in the meantime!) and you are great at communicating issues so that I can improve things. I thank you for that.

Edited by subtledoctor, 24 August 2017 - 07:10 AM.

[sllenrof]

Hi Roxanne:

I encountered a weird problem when installing Sandrah Saga using BWS.

It said it was unable to install [Sandrah EET additions], because it was unable to find Resource [CVJenlig.CRE]. Afterwards, it reverted Sandrah EET additions installation, but kept the other elements of Sandrah Saga.

I would be very grateful if you could tell me whether I did anything wrong.

Here is Sandrah Saga debug file

 Setup-SandrahNPC.debug   2.3MB   640 downloads

Please let me know if you need anything else to locate the problem.

I am looking forward to try your mod

Thank you in advance for your help

Edited by sllenrof, 03 September 2017 - 04:49 AM.

[Roxanne]

Hi Roxanne:

I encountered a weird problem when installing Sandrah Saga using BWS.

It said it was unable to install [Sandrah EET additions], because it was unable to find Resource [CVJenlig.CRE]. Afterwards, it reverted Sandrah EET additions installation, but kept the other elements of Sandrah Saga.

I would be very grateful if you could tell me whether I did anything wrong.

Here is Sandrah Saga debug file

Setup-SandrahNPC.debug

Please let me know if you need anything else to locate the problem.

I am looking forward to try your mod

Thank you in advance for your help

The error is here

ERROR: cannot convert %CVMystra% or %%CVMystra%% to an integer.

 

This is a random error which sometimes appears in large modded installations. It is caused by some unfinished action from a previous mod. Generally by some mod using an outdated method to add a kit.

 

Try this

- pause BWS

- manually start setup-SandrahNPC.exe

- uninmstall ALL components from Sandrah

- Manually start setup-SandrahNPC.exe again and chose ask every component.

- Install the components one by one, see that there are no errors.

When the mod is successfully installed, resume BWS.

Normally this procedure works fine.

[Samriel]

So now that version 2.05 is out is it possible to install it over a manual 2.04 install?