1095 replies to this topic

[Roxanne]

Sorry Roxanne, I can´t remember which flags or requirements I changed. Only thing I know for sure is, that I had to change something. At least some of the items like her chainmail have level requirements. It´s possible, that her level was lower at the time of her recruitment. Don´t know, how this might have happened (one component alters the xp-table). Also stat requirements can be a problem. SoB/Item Revision reduce dexterity based on armor-type. Another component reduces strength if you only use a one handed weapon. 

There may be additional issues there, some of her items have strength requirements (which she normally meets) Or dexterity...Under normal condition it means she cannot use her stuff if those abilities are drained - but permanent change makes her kind of unusable.

Of course it´s possible, that my changed install order caused this problems. It´s even likely. When I made this install I was simply afraid that none of the gameplay changes from the other mods would apply to the sandrah-npc, so I changed the installorder. Gameplay and storywise I hadn´t any mayor problems so far. Only the fat man at the end of the demonic scroll quest was nearly unbeatable. 

,,,the fat man at the end of the demonic scroll quest was nearly unbeatable. He has that surprise factor working for him when you meet him unprepared for the first time...

Regarding item usability-flags, in my newest install, with nearly the same mod selection, except Sandrah, I noticed (with subtledoctors help) a false allocation in the kitlist.2da-file. I was wondering, because my Fighter/Cleric of Tempus Multiclass was restricted to studded leather. Maybe in my install the Sandrah-npc had a similar issue. Maybe the item-flags are ok, but class and usability do not match. 

 

The fat man... With nearly unbeatable I mean that I had to cheese my way through. No way I could have beaten him fair and square. He started to summon hordes of creatures and I don´t think he would have stopped, if I hadn´t killed him fast. Compared to that the second greyclan episode (death knights, adamantit golems) was a walk in the park.

 

If you still have that install with the fat man, I would be interested in it. I assume some mod assigns an extra script to an empty slot, because the summoning of monster hords is not from my mod. The file name is sandbl1.cre.

Edited by Roxanne, 17 August 2017 - 08:46 PM.

[Roxanne]

Sorry Roxanne, I can´t remember which flags or requirements I changed. Only thing I know for sure is, that I had to change something. At least some of the items like her chainmail have level requirements. It´s possible, that her level was lower at the time of her recruitment. Don´t know, how this might have happened (one component alters the xp-table). Also stat requirements can be a problem. SoB/Item Revision reduce dexterity based on armor-type. Another component reduces strength if you only use a one handed weapon. 

There may be additional issues there, some of her items have strength requirements (which she normally meets) Or dexterity...Under normal condition it means she cannot use her stuff if those abilities are drained - but permanent change makes her kind of unusable.

Of course it´s possible, that my changed install order caused this problems. It´s even likely. When I made this install I was simply afraid that none of the gameplay changes from the other mods would apply to the sandrah-npc, so I changed the installorder. Gameplay and storywise I hadn´t any mayor problems so far. Only the fat man at the end of the demonic scroll quest was nearly unbeatable. 

,,,the fat man at the end of the demonic scroll quest was nearly unbeatable. He has that surprise factor working for him when you meet him unprepared for the first time...

Regarding item usability-flags, in my newest install, with nearly the same mod selection, except Sandrah, I noticed (with subtledoctors help) a false allocation in the kitlist.2da-file. I was wondering, because my Fighter/Cleric of Tempus Multiclass was restricted to studded leather. Maybe in my install the Sandrah-npc had a similar issue. Maybe the item-flags are ok, but class and usability do not match. 

 

The fat man... With nearly unbeatable I mean that I had to cheese my way through. No way I could have beaten him fair and square. He started to summon hordes of creatures and I don´t think he would have stopped, if I hadn´t killed him fast. Compared to that the second greyclan episode (death knights, adamantit golems) was a walk in the park.

 

This is the fate of the Sandrah mod.

Since she comes in very early in the game and the mod covers a lot of ground, it is the detector and indicator for many issues that you find otherwise only at later stages. Therefore she is often treated as the culprit for a lot of bugs even though she just points to them.

[Roxanne]

Cre-file and Weidu.log are sufficient? If so you have to tell me how to upload files in this forum. 

If you use NI or EE-keeper it is sufficient to just tell me what that creatures assigned scripts are, if different from this:

Override - shoutpro

Class - mage18a

Race - agrandbr (or none)

General - none

Default - bpdemon

Edited by Roxanne, 17 August 2017 - 10:43 PM.

[Roxanne]

Cre-file and Weidu.log are sufficient? If so you have to tell me how to upload files in this forum. 

If you use NI or EE-keeper it is sufficient to just tell me what that creatures assigned scripts are, if different from this:

Override - shoutpro

Class - mage18a

Race - agrandbr (or none)

General - none

Default - bpdemon

No all looks to be in order. I have looked at the creature file in my override-folder and in the mod folder from sandrah npc. The look nearly the same. The xp value is different since I reduced it with another mod. Also his known and memorized spells are not exactly the same. This is true for both cre-files. Weird. He has 3 Monster summoning spells available. Monster summoning 4 (4x) and 6 (1x) as well as summon shadow (3x). Maybe i exaggerated a bit but since he has spells like disintegrate and power word kill on top of being nearly invulnerable for a party of level 4-5 (Greater Spelldeflection, Stoneskin, Globe of Invulnerability) I had to resort to cheesing him. 

However your observations prove my assumption.

Using generic scripts like e.g. Mage18a for the Fat Man, means that the script will use whatever spells the creature has if it finds the triggers to be true. So, if some mod gives the guy more spells, the script will use them. In the original creature, those extra spells will be skipped by the script. This means that the opponent was made that strong by the mod that added the extra abilities to my original cre-file.

This design is intended by Sandrah mod, i.e. if you install mods that make the game extra hard, my enemies will also be stronger, in order to follow the players intention to get harder battles. Nevertheless, I have no control of what exactly other mods add.

 

If you run change-log for sandbl1.cre, it will tell you which mod did it, and whether the issue was due to your chosen install sequence.

[Roxanne]

If you run change-log for sandbl1.cre, it will tell you which mod did it, and whether the issue was due to your chosen install sequence.

Sorry for this I will need your help. If it´s not too much to ask, can you give me instruction how to use this weidu function. It´s a very convenient tool but I don´t know how to use it.

Put the attached file into the bg2ee directory where your EET is installed - I have configured it for Fat Man already.

- Create an empty folder called change-log in the BG2ee directory (same hierachy as all the mod folders).

- Run the bat file

- open the change-log folder, it will have a txt file with the information you want. It also has a copy of all the former versions of the file if it was changed. You can use those to restore the changes by moving an earlier version into the override folder (after removing the version number).

 

For any further use, just open the bat file with a text editor and change the filename to whatever you want to search for.

 

Pre-requisite is that you have a weidu.exe in your game folder (i.e. one that is called weidu.exe and not setup-modxxx.exe). If not, simply make a copy of just any setup-modxxx.exe and re-name the copy to weidu.exe.

Attached Files

•  change-log.rar   437bytes   130 downloads

Edited by Roxanne, 18 August 2017 - 01:33 AM.

[Roxanne]

Hey thanks, I didn´t learn much but this I can use in the future (until I get to learn it myself). Only two other mods alter the cre-file. First the mentioned xp-change (eet tweaks), second the initial component of SCS (ver.30 BWP fix, kathos eet compatibility + kresos spell revision compatibility). As is often the case, SCS gets its hands on everything. Shame it´s such a good mod.  

 

On another note, I just saw that you turned nearly every component of SoB to expert. Do you really think this is necessary. I guess the proficiency changes are a little wonky right now, but as far as I understand only in combination with FnP. The magic resistance overhaul and the stat changes are very intrusive, but subtledoctor brings this up in the readme. The revised armor system or the changed xp- and saving throw-tables on the other hand are working smoothly.  Marking the entire mod expert will hold  many people (like me) back from using the mod, because the think it´s bug riddled or unstable. I have used most of the components for quite some time and it really brings a new challenge to the gameplay. 

Thank you for all your patience and assistance. This has been very helpful.

 

Here are the conclusions

Sandrah is compatible with all mods in question, it is simply a matter of install sequence. This is already the case in BWS but I now made that more explicit due to your findings and my own additional testing.

• Sandrah after scales_of_balance;122
• Sandrah after SCS 1000, 4110, 4120, 4190
• Sandrah after xpmod
• Sandrah after EET_Tweaks 3030, 2060-70

This way, Sandrah will include the changes made by those mods but will not have those mods *re-balance* files and contents that is already balanced in the mod itself.

 

Concerning SoB, marking it expert is always required if a mod makes it necessary to revert to console or use a game editor when installed. Sadly, BWS does not allow this to be focussed on single components, i.e if it applies to just one component it still marks all the mod. There is explanation in the BWS selection menu for it, so you will know why. Also, marking it does not mean you cannot select it. It just means there is an extra *are you sure you want this?*

Until now, only two mods (aside from Sandrah) could be identified with similar issues, but there may be more. Otherwise this could be simply handled by *Conflict* in BWS.

Edited by Roxanne, 18 August 2017 - 02:36 AM.

[Roxanne]

add first point: With the help of this new tool I can confirm that the kit usability flag, which is set in the kitlist.2da-file changes from the original value 0x00004000 after installation of the CVMystra-kit (is there a list which related kits to the numbers?) to 0x01000000 after FnP. Maybe this is the root of the problem with usability. In this case install order would probably solve the problem.

Sandrah has a F+P compatibility feature implemented, so it can be installed after F+P and still make use of the sphere system.

Also any problem with SoB should be solved by install order. I have observed issues with item usability with earlier F+P versions (Sandrah could use many additional items she should not be able to use) but  I have not tested it with the new and improved F+P version yet.

 

There remains the SoB issue for personal custom items of other mod NPCs, e.g. Chloe, Tenya (probably more but it will take time to find them all). No idea yet, how that can be solved - other than installing some SoB components early, so that they leave mod NPCs out?

Edited by Roxanne, 18 August 2017 - 04:11 AM.

[Roxanne]

I still don´t  know. It lies on my conscience, that the entire mod is made expert because of a little, probably only temporary problem, which I discovered.

You are right. No use to apply BWS rules. The more people install it and run into errors the more reports and data there will be to clearly analyse the impact and repair it. Meanwhile the list of affected mod NPCs grows.

[franco8737]

Sorry for off topic.

 

AFAIK, Yasraena from CoM also affected by SoB, the unique short sword made for her will become unusable unless you cheat or change the STR of her back to 18.

Edited by franco8737, 18 August 2017 - 06:25 AM.

[Roxanne]

Sorry for off topic.

 

AFAIK, Yasraena from CoM also affected by SoB, the unique short sword made for her will become unusable unless you cheat or change the STR of her back to 18.

This is an issue that is pretty similar to the Tweaks Anthology component for Romance Cheats, it breaks a large number of mod NPCs.

In both cases, there is little that BWS can do, because either you establish a list of all mods that suffer or you make the offending mod *Expert*. In both cases it requires tools to repair your game if you encounter the problem. A third possibility is, to disable the component in BWS, Since the mods are actively maintained, that decision should be made by the respective modders.

Edited by Roxanne, 18 August 2017 - 06:58 AM.

[Roxanne]

Sorry for off topic.

 

AFAIK, Yasraena from CoM also affected by SoB, the unique short sword made for her will become unusable unless you cheat or change the STR of her back to 18.

Another thing I discovered is that SoB also changes animals and animal companions. Haiass, the wolf companion, for example started to attack (evil) party members all of a sudden, another one left the area on every second turn of the game just to re-appear on any other. Uninstalled the mod, and all is back to normal.

There are far too many issues at once with this mod to really go into analyzing them.

Edited by Roxanne, 19 August 2017 - 04:22 AM.

[Roxanne]

Dear Roxanne,

 

Absolutely loving your mod.  Truly awsome piece of work.  Have just completed the pirate isle but am having a problem exiting the island.  Sandrah says "All aboard" but then nothing happens

You mean this?

Spoiler

Sandrah says ~Then put the books here on the table and let us start. The sky looks like a fair day and my Waterdeep weather nose tells me we will have the same at least tomorrow.~
You replay~ All hands on deck! (You have heard poor Captain Holghorn use these words on your trip to the island.)

 

Place the book you found on the captain and the book you found down in the ship on the table near the masts. The show should go on.