78 replies to this topic

[The Imp]

Hello, thanks for the new release.
With refinements, do you get Use any item if you also install Rogue rebalancing ?

In which install order do you think you are going to use ?

[subtledoctor]

Hello, thanks for the new release.
With refinements, do you get Use any item if you also install Rogue rebalancing ?

Vanilla game gives you UAI
Rogue Rebalancing doesnt touch it (AFAIK)
Refinements takes it away and replaces it with Use Magical Device (UAI for scrolls and wands only)

If you want UAI, use RR thief HLAs only. If you want UMD instead, use RR thief HLAs followed by Refinements thief HLAs.

[The Imp]

Or you could just cheese the thing and edit the kits .2da file after Refinements install, and give it the UAI anyways. It's not like the thing is not there.

... and replaces it with Use Magical Device (UAI for scrolls and wands only

It's not actually that.

Edited by The Imp, 01 May 2020 - 04:48 PM.

[subtledoctor]

It's not actually that.

As usual Imp, I have no idea what you are talking about.

[The Imp]

It's not actually that.

As usual Imp, I have no idea what you are talking about.

Well, let me reintroduce you to your own mod, at least in the non-EE Refinements parts, the tweak the mod does is the removal of the spcl915 from the table, and replaces it with the UMD, what that does is, it assigns new kits to EVERY already exising kit user, this is done so that the kit now can use the expanded kit flags that are reassigned to have access to the previously unusable items. This includes the "Thief" -kit, which is normally the number 0. Making it no longer a non-kitted character, and you know what happens when you export one of those ? -from a moded game. You break them.

Add in an item after your mods install, and the item won't be usable by thieves, any of them even when they get the supposed usability ability. Add in a new thief kit mod and the same cheese is just more cheese. And you potentially run into the 255 kit limit in the non-EE games, as you tripple the thief kit amount, make it extreamly hard to install a few specific mods that use the kit flags and other things.

Also do you even understand why the ALWAYS block has the kit.ids edit... it's there just for this.

 

So from the removal of the opcode 302 from useage, to crippling tripple kit and disabiling items tweak. Nice going.

Edited by The Imp, 03 May 2020 - 01:30 AM.

[subtledoctor]

It has come to my attention that Refinements has been hosing STATDESC.2da on the EE games.  I've updated the 4.0 branch to version 4.27 to fix that.

[Magus]

Hi.

Release 4.28 still shows "beta 4.27" version.

Sword Angel fails to install without the first component, not sure if it's supposed to work without it, if not, should probably require it:

Installing [Sword Angel - New Fighter Kit] [beta 4.27]
Copying and patching 1 file ...
Appending to files ...
Appending to files ...
Appending to files ...
Copying 1 file ...
Copying and patching 2495 files ...
Copying and patching 1 file ...
Copying 1 file ...
Copying and patching 1 file ...
Copying 1 file ...
Copying 1 file ...
Copying and patching 1 file ...
Copying 1 file ...
ERROR: error loading [refinements/Hlab/_shared/copy/STATES2.BAM]
Stopping installation because of error.
Stopping installation because of error.
Stopping installation because of error.

ERROR Installing the `Sword Angel - New Fighter Kit' component, rolling back to previous state
Will uninstall   6 files for [refinements/setup-refinements.tp2] component 50.
Uninstalled      6 files for [refinements/setup-refinements.tp2] component 50.
ERROR: Unix.Unix_error(Unix.ENOENT, "stat", "refinements/hlab/_shared/copy/states2.bam")
Please post the file refinements.debug at http://forums.spellh...p?showforum=116
Using Language [English]

[darkkhaine]

Hello and thanks for the updated refinements mod!

 

I think i found a bug for the monk HLAs, where I can only select some abilities once (for example Monk regeneration). I sometimes can't select the HLA Second Wind (though when I tried to reproduce this bug, I could select it). Here is the screenshot.

 

 

Thanks for your support.

Attached Images

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Attached Files

•  WeiDU.log   20.32K   131 downloads

Edited by darkkhaine, 15 November 2021 - 04:55 AM.

[Greenhorn]

Great to see that this mod is updated for EE. However, compatibility wise, is this mod still incompatible with Multiclassed Multikit mod or any other mod in fact which adds kits to multi or dual classed characters?

[Graion Dilach]

Multiclassed Multikit doesn't even create the HLA tables right (it doesn't copy the result to override and throws a fullpath to luabbr.2da). Refinements does try to perform the HLA changes on mod-added kits as well by default though (including multikits) unless you disable that behaviour in d5_refinements_settings.ini.

 

If you really want to use Multiclassed Multikits, then that should come after everything else and you should always rebuild your multikits on the install (this is safe because MMBM always takes the current state of the class files although you still need to fix the HLAs manually).

Edited by Graion Dilach, 17 April 2022 - 05:25 AM.

[Greenhorn]

Multiclassed Multikit doesn't even create the HLA tables right (it doesn't copy the result to override and throws a fullpath to luabbr.2da). Refinements does try to perform the HLA changes on mod-added kits as well by default though (including multikits) unless you disable that behaviour in d5_refinements_settings.ini.

 

If you really want to use Multiclassed Multikits, then that should come after everything else and you should always rebuild your multikits on the install (this is safe because MMBM always takes the current state of the class files although you still need to fix the HLAs manually).

Thanks Graion, I didn't know that MM is in such bad shape, but it is not the only mod which gives kits to multiclasses and it is comforting to know that Refinements will no longer crash at HLA  screen with kits added to multiclasses. 

[subtledoctor]

Updated to version 4.31 with updated handling of the SPECIFIC.IDS table for the Use Magical Device thief HLA.

[subtledoctor]

Whoops, and version 4.32 also has updated French and Russian translations!

[Graion Dilach]

Report from the IE Discord; Revised Armors component is broken -. you renamed the ident.tp2 and co. to tphs, but forgot to update the extensions in the code: https://github.com/U...mor/init.tpa#L9

[ALIEN]

It's my oversight from PR https://github.com/U...inements/pull/4. I've send a new one, tested BG2EE installation, hopefully this will fix it.

EDIT: Malformed link.

Edited by ALIEN, 15 January 2023 - 12:55 PM.

[subtledoctor]

It's my oversight from PR https://github.com/U...inements/pull/4. I've send a new one, tested BG2EE installation, hopefully this will fix it.

 

Merged the new one.
 

[subtledoctor]

Incidentally, I might be going back to using op181 for Use Magical Device, instead of setting SPECIFIC values. Even with workarounds to make the SPECIFIC thing work with SoD and such, I've still had occasional intermittent problems with characters using scrolls and wands. Op181 is not perfect, but if it has problems in-game, those problems will tend to be smaller and more manageable.

 

The method I've landed on at the moment works like this:

 

• -- Any wands that are normally usable by non-wizards (with the exception of the Wand of the Heavens) are changed from type 35 to type 13. Type 13 is labeled "Food" and is used for e.g. the Goodberry consumable item. Type 13 "food" items can have charges just like wands, they are used from item quickslots just like wands. If you change the Wand of Magic Missiles to type 13 you can use it until it has 1 charge, then sell it to a store and buy it back, and what you buy back will be a wand with x charges, where x is determined by the .STO file's setting for how many charges it gives wands. (And this is responsive to mods like Low Magic World which change .STO files to sell wands with fewer charges.) The mod changes all stores and containers to buy/sell/store type 13 items if they already bought/sold/stored type 35 items. One unavoidable consequence of this is, if you use a Wand Case mod, you will be able to put Goodberries and other type 13 items into a wand case.
•  
• -- Any scrolls that cast spells but are not arcane scrolls you can also learn spells from, are changed from type 11 to type 8. Type 8 is labeled "Keys" and includes mostly just various keys. Even though most in-game keys don't do it, type 8 "key" items can cast spells and be used from item quickslots, just like scrolls. They of course do not have scrolls' hardcoded inventory UI function to learn spells, which is why the only scrolls being changed this way are green "use by anyone" scrolls and blue "cast a priest spell" scrolls. The mod changes all stores and containers to buy/sell/store type 8 items if they already bought/sold/stored type 11 items. One consequence of this - and admittedly it is slightly more consequential than the first change - is that you will be able to put keys into a scroll case.
•  
• -- Once the wands and scrolls already usable by non-wizards are separated into their own categories, the leftover wizard scrolls and wands are made usable by anyone. Then, for party members, every joinable non-wizard/non-bard NPC gets a permanent op181 effect making them unable to use type 35 and type 11 items (wizard-only wands and scrolls). For Charname, this is applied by script in the various areas that start each campaign in BGEE, SoD, BG2EE, ToB, EET, BP1, BP2, and IWDEE. A spell with op321 and op206 canceling and protecting from the "don't use" spell is added to every wizard kit CLAB table, so that anyone with the op181 spell who dual-classes to wizard will gain the ability to use arcane scrolls.
•  
• -- Finally, that same spell in wizard CLAB tables can be applied anywhere else in the game - as an HLA in Refinements, as a combat skill in Scales of Balance, as a kit ability for priests of Mystra in Faiths & Powers, etc.

 

The one limitation this adds compared to the current implementation is that divine wands and scrolls will still be governed by their usability flags. A thief with UMD will not be able to cast Restoration from a scroll. The rationalization for this is that arcane casters are deemed to have in a sense "hacked" some secrets of the universe, and do magic by intelligence; there is no god around to stop a wizard from doing their magic. By contrast, divine magic is a direct grant of power from a god, and those gods will not extend this grant to faithless thieves who happen to have figured out how to operate a wand. (To apply this to divine items as well would require a new item type(s) and I'm not sure there are any more that have the required characteristics... I think type 0 would work for divine scrolls, but I'm not sure about wands, and anyway there are a LOT of type 0 items in the game so the mish-mash of what fits in which container would become more chaotic.)

 

I've externalized this into a portable .tpa file that can be easily used by all different mods. I haven't pulled the trigger and actually uploaded release versions with this change, yet. I will either a) install and test it on my own game, and see how it performs myself - which may take weeks or months, since I am in the middle of an EET game with the old method - or b) make beta "pre-release" versions that other players can use and, essentially, test, at their own discretion.

Edited by subtledoctor, 07 February 2023 - 07:49 AM.

[subtledoctor]

Here's a question, before I upload that:

 

Would it be worth it to separate wands and scrolls and handle them separately? I guess it would be fairly easy, now. I don't have a particular use-case... maybe some kind of technologist or luck-based kit could use wands, but actually casting spells from scrolls would still be out of bounds? Or maybe priests of Oghma or Deneir could use arcane scrolls, being so studious, but would not go around flashing wands at people?

 

Hmm. I suppose why not?