8 replies to this topic

[Argent77]

Now that my Djinni Companion mod (see here for more information) is mostly done, I'm wondering how many banters are appropriate. The story and character development is mostly driven by the quests the player has to complete. The banters with the protagonist of the game are mainly used to shed some light on the djinni's past.

I had planned to add at least three banters with each of the Bioware NPCs and I have sketched out about 30 banters with the protagonist so far. Some of them depend on certain conditions, so at least 23 are triggered in any case.

As there are five major quests and a few mini quests, depending on the NPCs in the party, I'm not sure if that many banters are really needed. The djinni has a very extensive player initiated dialog after all.

What is your view on this subject? Can you live with a more silent djinni on your side or do you need him to talk about himself (and others) continuously?

[Ulb]

I picked ''I need banters, banter, banters!'', since you can never have too many banters (as long as they are well written..).

Though, that doesn't mean an npc mod needs to have tons and tons of banters to be a 'good' npc mod.

 

Usually I would say 30 main banters and about two banters for each Bioware npc are pretty much the standard amount I would expect from a new npc mod.

*edit* (Though, those 30 banters are usually for romance-npcs, who should have an ..uh .. 'deeper' relation with the protagonist anyway.) *edit*

 

However, if your djin already has five major quests and an extensive pid going for it, that will of course lower the amount of banters 'needed' to make him a compelling npc. (Also, since your djin doesn't occupy a party slot, he's pretty much a no-brainer installation anyway, regardless of the amount of banters he offers. )

 

In that light, I'd say more banters are always welcome, but there probably is no need for you to force it and add a couple more, meaningless banters just for the sake of reaching some mythical number of banters. (Also, an npc with 10 well written banters still beats an npc with 100 meaningless banters by miles.)

 

PS: If you feel like adding more banters, I'd much rather see some cross-mod content banters than 'just more Bioware or Protagonist banters'.

Edited by Ulb, 03 May 2013 - 02:46 AM.

[Argent77]

You are right, good banters need interesting topics to talk about. As most of his banters deal with either his own past or the protagonist's problems, 30 banters are almost too many already. Don't forget that you can order the djinni to stay in his lamp. In that state he won't banter with anyone except in very special cases.

 

Usually I would say 30 main banters and about two banters for each Bioware npc are pretty much the standard amount I would expect from a new npc mod.

*edit* (Though, those 30 banters are usually for romance-npcs, who should have an ..uh .. 'deeper' relation with the protagonist anyway.) *edit*

Well, I doubt that an ancient dawn-of-time type djinni would start a romantic relationship with a human (or elf, or gnome, or ...), especially if you get to know his personality. But stranger things have happened...

 

Cross-mod banters are a good idea, but I'm still in the middle of finding interesting topics for some of the Bioware NPCs. So I'll probably think about it only after releasing the mod.

[jastey]

Are we talking about banters (npc-npc interaction) or do you also mean npc-pc dialogues? Because I can live without the former, but the latter I want to have as much as possible. (Well, maybe not a noober/neeber "stutterbug", but you know what I mean).

[Argent77]

@jastey: My bad, I was primarily talking about NPC-PC dialogs. I've always counted them as banters too, but that doesn't seem to be the case.

 

It looks like PC dialogs have more significance than NPC banters. That's a bit surprising to me, because I always liked the cat fights between party members more than the inquisitive approaches of romantic interests.

 

Maybe I should condense my already sketched out conversation to less but higher quality dialogs and add one or two new topics instead. I'd like to hear more opinions about it though.

[Ulb]

It looks like PC dialogs have more significance than NPC banters. That's a bit surprising to me, because I always liked the cat fights between party members more than the inquisitive approaches of romantic inter

 

NO!!

 

You are not alone with that opinion. I was just about to write that I would choose npc-npc banters over npc-player dialogues any time.

In my opinion it is and always has been the npc-npc banters that made BG2 feel so in-depth and alive.

Edited by Ulb, 03 May 2013 - 01:43 PM.

[jastey]

I "clicked" through too many weak npc-banters to say that they really interest me. "Aerie, you have no wings!" - "Well, doh!" "Valygar, so you loath mages?" - "Well, yeah!" "Viconia, you are an evil drow!" - "Yes, from the Underdark!" It was berelinde who saved me from a real dilemma by writing most of the npc-banters for my Ajantis mod - really good ones! Real interactions like they can happen if you spent 24/7 with fighting comrades on dusty roads. These I like. And smart romantic conflicts, too. But for that, you need a romance, of course. (Although I would appreciate the npc not to shut up after my pc chose a love interest. Yay to friendship paths!)

 

Argent77: If you are ready to write more banters/dialogues than you think players want to see, there is always the possibility to give the player the choice to "mute" the NPC via dialogue options (or by character design, if the PC shows no interest at all). There are players that do not want the dialogues, but still enjoy a good designed NPC. Nevertheless, I think the group of "As much dialogues/banters as possible" is in the majority.

[Argent77]

Then I'll try to make the banters as memorable as possible. At least for some NPCs they already lead to unexpected results.

 

there is always the possibility to give the player the choice to "mute" the NPC via dialogue options (or by character design, if the PC shows no interest at all).

That's a great idea. I had thought about a way to cancel a series of banters (or PC dialogs) via dialog option some time ago, but masking it as a lack of interest, maybe expressed over a couple of conversations, sounds so much more believable.

[Aion]

I voted for 15 banters or so, meaning at least 2 banters between the mod NPC and each Bioware NPC. NPC/PC dialogues are very much wanted, in my opinion, whether romantic, friendly, or neither. It makes more sense for the people following you to want to get to know more about you, and vice versa. Both types of dialogue are important and breathe life into the game.

 

5 major quests for one NPC seems a bit much, but since I don't know anything about this mod, I can't and won't really judge.

 

Jastey makes a good point about making dialogues more interesting. Some things would still come up, I think, although one can write around that, or deliver it in a better way.