111 replies to this topic

[micbaldur]

While playing BWP i had previously problems to get back BG2 side after i finished NEJ part 2 and end up to Ulcaster. Well i have to CLUA:Console myself to BG2 side.

Is there any reasons to block access to BG1 side from BG2 side (also later from ToB side). I can't think any reasons from players point of view (other than BG1 NPCs but what's the harm in it). I don't know anything about modding so i can't say is it a problem for modders and mods.

This might be a stupid question but understand i'm a simple stupid player.

[Jarno Mikkola]

Well, all the NPCs assume that you are at the same stage as you would be in the original games... and thus the game time doesn't continue for them, and there's really no reason to go back.

problems to get back BG2 side after i finished NEJ part 2 and end up to Ulcaster.

I am pretty sure that problem is there because of NEJ, as the mod is part of the eXpert install, which is bug filled anyway.

[micbaldur]

Well, all the NPCs assume that you are at the same stage as you would be in the original games... and thus the game time doesn't continue for them, and there's really no reason to go back.

problems to get back BG2 side after i finished NEJ part 2 and end up to Ulcaster.

I am pretty sure that problem is there because of NEJ, as the mod is part of the eXpert install, which is bug filled anyway.

Well i'm not after those NPCs, i know that BG1 NPCs doesn't have BG2 content. Except maybe Rose NPC (BGT NPC) and she goes to Beregost if i kick her at BG2. Well she's beta mod and doesn't have much content so she doesn't matter either.

I also know that there aren't reason to go back but what's the harm in going back BG1 areas if i still want to (maybe holiday or sightseeing). Does it break mods or something else in the game i don't know. That's why i ask.

As for bugs in NEJ only big problem i encounter was that ending at Ulcaster. Only couple hanging cutscenes (easily fixable) and locked Vulova Estate at Government (easily fixable).

[Jarno Mikkola]

I also know that there aren't reason to go back but what's the harm in going back BG1 areas if i still want to (maybe holiday or sightseeing). Does it break mods or something else in the game i don't know. That's why i ask.

Well, if you really wish to look at things, it does brake the BG1-BGII transition in BGT...

Spoiler

as the story goes that you are ambushed during the path from Baldur's Gate to A(whatever the city's name is), as you are supposed to deliver a message there from Belt(the Grand Duke of Baldur's Gate) to where ever it was.

And let's remember that the chapter counter is quite important to the integrity of the game, and the BGT mods actually have a variable that is set when the BG1 part is over... so they(BG1 encounters) wouldn't fire up in random places like the Underdark in BGII... but it's not bullet proof, so the it's not checked by every script that should in case you had the possibility to travel back.

[micbaldur]

Well, if you really wish to look at things, it does brake the BG1-BGII transition in BGT.

And let's remember that the chapter counter is quite important to the integrity of the game, and the BGT mods actually have a variable that is set when the BG1 part is over... so they(BG1 encounters) wouldn't fire up in random places like the Underdark in BGII... but it's not bullet proof, so the it's not checked by every script that should in case you had the possibility to travel back.

How can it break the BGT transition because it has already happened. I'm talking about going back from BG2 areas to BG1 areas not BG1 areas to BG2 areas.

Well about those chapter counters and encounters i don't know anything so i can't say anything about them.

[Kaeloree]

With modifications to both BG1 and BGII scripts it might be possible, but it would be a difficult proposition. Most likely many mods would break (because they require specific variables to be set, which could easily be miss-set as you go from BGII > BG1 and back).

I seem to recall there was something else in the way of such a mod, as well, but I can't for the life of me recall what it was.

[micbaldur]

With modifications to both BG1 and BGII scripts it might be possible, but it would be a difficult proposition. Most likely many mods would break (because they require specific variables to be set, which could easily be miss-set as you go from BGII > BG1 and back).

I seem to recall there was something else in the way of such a mod, as well, but I can't for the life of me recall what it was.

OK i understand that it you be a bad idea. I'll take you word for it.

Then in the future i'm going to CLUA:Console myself out of Ulcaster after finishing NEJ part 2 (until someone fixes the mod). Heh i was tempted to visit some old places in BG1.

Thanks for answering.

[Jarno Mikkola]

How can it break the BGT transition because it has already happened. I'm talking about going back from BG2 areas to BG1 areas not BG1 areas to BG2 areas.

Well, there's the fact that if you allow the BGII areas to have the access to BG1 areas, you also need to come back to the BGII areas... which makes the transition brake cause you could make to the BGII areas strait from the BG1, with level 1 character... and the BGII's first outside area was never meant to be entered from anywhere else than the (BGII)start dungeon, as it leads to the cut scene with Imoen.

[micbaldur]

Well, there's the fact that if you allow the BGII areas to have the access to BG1 areas, you also need to come back to the BGII areas... which makes the transition brake cause you could make to the BGII areas strait from the BG1, with level 1 character... and the BGII's first outside area was never meant to be entered from anywhere else than the (BGII)start dungeon, as it leads to the cut scene with Imoen.

I don't understand that. How can i enter with level 1 character to BG2 areas from BG1 because areas come visible after transition to BG2.

This is pointless and it doesn't matter. I understand other reasons why it's bad thing go to back BG1 areas.

[i30817]

Couldn't it be possible with a mega quest mod - instead of using the same actors and script files, replace the area files scripts and the spawned npcs by other guys (possibly copies in everything except quests scripts and dialogs).


Yeah, it would be frustrating not being able to return the flamedance ring, big deal...

It wouldn't take into account quest mods that added things, except if they wanted to make a component to it though.

Edited by i30817, 12 September 2011 - 07:07 PM.

[Vlan]

bump.

 

Any new info about that specific topic? Are there any other players who went back to BG1 and still were able to beat BG2 without any problems?

[Creepin]

I totally agree.

I'm used to clua back to BG1 part regularly, if only to raid my stash of collection value items I've gathered throughout BG1 & its mods, and it never caused any glitches I'm aware of. But even if there's some quirks, I believe it to be the problem of the mods acting funny because of player's return to BG1, and by no means the reason to forbid such travel.

With that being said, I would surely welcome mod unlocking BG1 areas from BG2 part of the game, and those mods that might have issues with variables will just have to adapt to the new reality of really open Faerun... or die trying

[The Imp]

So other than cheating in items, what are you doing in the North-er part of the Sword Coast ? ... and Killing Drizzt ? All the encounters have 3 to 4 levels bellow your party average level. Yeah, we could make there to be a passage only unlocable from the BG 2 part... but it would serve no real purpose other than the above functions, and you can do those with the console.

I don't understand that. How can i enter with level 1 character to BG2 areas from BG1 because areas come visible after transition to BG2.

Well, with a luck +20'es and the like, you can legally break every rule in the d20 book. As in, it's not about how you do it, just that it can be done.

Edited by The Imp, 01 December 2013 - 01:41 PM.

[micbaldur]

Well, with a luck +20'es and the like, you can legally break every rule in the d20 book. As in, it's not about how you do it, just that it can be done.
 

Heh here we go again.

 

I still don't understand why we are talking about entering BG2 areas from BG1. I was talking about entering BG1 areas from BG2 areas after BG2 starts after Irenicus Dungeon.

 

Maybe this conversation between us needs finnish as language.

[Creepin]

and there's really no reason to go back.

it would serve no real purpose

Ok, I see your, rather long-standing, point on purpose
However, the purpose is not the alpha and omega of the game. For me, possibility is ten times more appealing. Along the same reasoning why I'm installing 50+ NPCs when I'm having playthrough with pe-generated party of 6, why I always make sure to remove "children are unkillable" even if I rarely or never kill these, lies the reasoning for proposed mod: even if there's no purpose in going back, I like to know there's possibility to do so should I want to.

Oh, and yes, cluaing myself to get that old weapon stash is cheating. Travelling to do so in a usual way is not, so I'm all for for removing cheating from the game!

Edited by Creepin, 01 December 2013 - 02:21 PM.

[Vlan]

So other than cheating in items, what are you doing in the North-er part of the Sword Coast ? ... and Killing Drizzt ? All the encounters have 3 to 4 levels bellow your party average level. Yeah, we could make there to be a passage only unlocable from the BG 2 part... but it would serve no real purpose other than the above functions, and you can do those with the console.

Roleplaying purposes and immersion. ;>

 

I have not started LotS with my party in BG1 and since I need some extra money for the Imoen rescue (80.000 gp, not 40.000gp) my group is trying to make some money in that spooky tower.

 

besides that, it's always possible to set the difficulty slider to impossible if things get too easy.

Edited by Vlan, 01 December 2013 - 03:18 PM.

[The Imp]

Oh, and yes, cluaing myself to get that old weapon stash is cheating. Travelling to do so in a usual way is not, so I'm all for for removing cheating from the game!

So regaining the 2 +3 scimitars from Drizzt dead corpse at the start of the BG2 game doesn't look like a cheat in your eyes in a BGT game when you can't do such in the BG2 game... the reason why the items are lost is a clear, they are stolen at the transition, it has always been so and should always be so... after all the game is balanced on the bases of that.

And you should understand that the distance of the travel is actually longer between the two cities than it seen in the map as there's mountain or sea between the two of them, and in the old times you just couldn't go pass them with a hike gear. I could make a mod, but to make it realistic, I would just throw in the travel time of 50 day just one way. Hmm or I would actually need to make what 120 different areas of transitions for one way so the chance of the random encounters is correct.

Well, I still haven't changed my insanity from the old days... even if the mind didn't survive the hell it went through.

Roleplaying purposes and immersion. ;>
I have not started LotS with my party in BG1 and since I need some extra money for the Imoen rescue (80.000 gp, not 40.000gp) my group is trying to make some money in that spooky tower.
besides that, it's always possible to set the difficulty slider to impossible if things get too easy.

Those are very bad reasons...
For one, going on a long trip just to make money so you can come back while the places that you are allowed to do so are much nearer ... not good for immersion or RP. The quests at the wolfwere infested cultists town that's on the verge of being annihilated by it's populace are quite rarity be there after the 50 days have passed, especially as the duke of BG is aware of some of the situation on some level and are likely to send other spies etc.

Maybe this conversation between us needs finnish as language.

Siitä sitten vaan, mä alotin, jatka ihan miten haluat.
Mutta ihan totisesti, kakkos pelin ideana on päästä vapauteen ensinnäkin, sitten pelastaa Imoen, ja sitten kostaa Irenikukselle, mä en näe tilaisuutta ilkutella 50+päivää ihan vaan mennä kattelemaan missä päin on tullu asuttua ja niin edespäin.

Edited by The Imp, 01 December 2013 - 03:44 PM.

[Vlan]

^

I did not know that it takes that much time to traverse between Amn and Baldurs Gate. The distance between both cities on the Worldmap looks pretty tiny.

 

The worldmap in general seems to be pretty wonky, imo. It only takes 8 hours to get from the Amn City Gates to the Umar Hills although the Umar Hills are waaaaaaaaaaaaaaay up in the east (which looks at least like a 6 days march).

Edited by Vlan, 01 December 2013 - 03:47 PM.

[micbaldur]

And you should understand that the distance of the travel is actually longer between the two cities than it seen in the map as there's mountain or sea between the two of them, and in the old times you just couldn't go pass them with a hike gear. I could make a mod, but to make it realistic, I would just throw in the travel time of 50 day just one way. Hmm or I would actually need to make what 120 different areas of transitions for one way so the chance of the random encounters is correct.
 

Great, Imp
 
Looking forward that mod of yours. Any estimated ETA of that mod (maybe for christmas).