1094 replies to this topic

[Lollorian]

@Roxanne: Just a heads up if you're going through the BWPFixpack for the NeJ patches

 

The patches for NeJ v691 + v694 are distributed among 7 folders in the BWPFixpack (that's right, 7 - #1, #2, #3, #4, #5, #6 & #7). I'm trying to consolidate them but it will take some testing to settle down on a single approach

 

And in case you're wondering why? The mess is a result of:

1) The BWP trying to support 3 different versions of NeJ at one point of time

2) NeJ's folder structure itself being messy as fuck

3) The BWP keeping actual fixes and compatibility patches separate from each other

[Roxanne]

@Roxanne: Just a heads up if you're going through the BWPFixpack for the NeJ patches

 

The patches for NeJ v691 + v694 are distributed among 7 folders in the BWPFixpack (that's right, 7 - #1, #2, #3, #4, #5, #6 & #7). I'm trying to consolidate them but it will take some testing to settle down on a single approach

 

And in case you're wondering why? The mess is a result of:

1) The BWP trying to support 3 different versions of NeJ at one point of time

2) NeJ's folder structure itself being messy as fuck

3) The BWP keeping actual fixes and compatibility patches separate from each other

Yes, I figured that out, no problem. My problem with NEJ is what it does to Aram00, the transition from BG1 to SoA. This is related to this issue http://www.shsforums...nsition-issues/

NEJ has some selected NPC for transition and depends on all others to have a new NPC start in SoA,

SandrahNPC is one of the few continuos NPCs in the game (in fact this is essential part of the mod) so she depends on the BGT transition (MeetOldenFriends etc) which NEJ overwrites.

It may be possible to write a new transition for Sandrah in case NEJ is installed but I still need some motivation for that (Is it worth it to have a NEJ compatible Sandrah mod?? - maybe not, as Vlad himself again and again advises against megamods to be installed together with NEJ)

For the moment I scratch NEJ from my to-do list and put it on ice, awaiting further BGT-NEJ development (if ever).

[The Imp]

For the moment I scratch NEJ from my to-do list and put it on ice, awaiting further BGT-NEJ development (if ever).

Well, when the v7 of NEJ comes out, you might wish to relook into this, but before that, you don't really have to. But if you care to do work now, you could ask Vlad the v7 from him in a PM, he is likely to give it to you.

[Roxanne]

For the moment I scratch NEJ from my to-do list and put it on ice, awaiting further BGT-NEJ development (if ever).

Well, when the v7 of NEJ comes out, you might wish to relook into this, but before that, you don't really have to. But if you care to do work now, you could ask Vlad the v7 from him in a PM, he is likely to give it to you.

The main issue for me is really the BGT transition referenced here http://www.shsforums...nsition-issues/

I can agree with Vlad that the current ARAM00 script is unnecessarily complicated and bug prone. His proposal is a starting point but currently a bit too self centered (Quote "Anyway, you should at least remove all those needless NPC checks which are dropped anyway. Take into account only Imoen, Jaheira, Minsc, Viconia, Edwin and my Shar-Teel as I do. You may also take into account other NPCs mods written for both BG1 and BG2, if any. I am aware only of my Shar-Teel.") This view is reflected in the ARAM00 overwrite that comes with NEJ.

It would require each modder who wants their NPC to go from BG1 to SoA without starting a new cre in SoA to add their own transition to the new ARAM00.bcs (and maybe also look at what he does to Belt and items). This is surely possible provided that the new Vlad transition becomes the new BGT standard.

In case of Sandrah it is to introduce new triggers for her transition (easy) but also to restore the Mae'Vaer cutscene and include it into her own cutscene (tricky) since that scene provides the background of how and why Sandrah appears in Amn in the way she does. The second part is double tricky if other mods want to transition their NPC seamlessly in ARAM00 as well (nobody seems to do that at the moment, except for me).

[Lollorian]

@micbaldur: I noticed that your install (if you're on the installation mentioned here) has the same install order as BWP 15.4 as far as BGT and NeJ go

 

Could you open up AR9799.ARE and check if it needs the Exit0070 region triggers please as mentioned in this post (for NeJ v6.8 )? Maybe this thing is handled differently in NeJv691?

Edited by Lollorian, 27 September 2015 - 04:43 AM.

[micbaldur]

@micbaldur: I noticed that your install (if you're on the installation mentioned here) has the same install order as BWP 15.4 as far as BGT and NeJ go

 

Could you open up AR9799.ARE and check if it needs the Exit0070 region triggers please as mentioned in this post (for NeJ v6.8 )? Maybe this thing is handled differently in NeJv691?

No, it's not handled diffently in NeJ 691, it overwrites Exit0070 and Area Patcher restores it.

[Lollorian]

Noticed this post - it seems I'll need to wait till someone does an install with atleast BWP v15.3 (which is when that NeJ patch was removed from the BWPFixpack )

 

Btw, the issue is not that AR9799.ARE is missing the Exit0070 entrance - I'm asking whether NeJ needs that entrance in the newer version (it might be using another entrance now because from what I see in NeJ v691's TP2, it specifically skips overwriting any BG1 area if it finds BGT installed - which Vlad mentioned in those posts)

 

The original AR9799.ARE from BGT doesn't have Exit0070

[micbaldur]

Well as usual i don't know nothing other than i had AR9799 CTD without that entrance in my old BWPs. This BWP didn't CTD because i had both Exit0070 and Exit9900,    shit i don't remember anymore which exit caused that CTD, probably Exit0070.

[Lollorian]

It would be easy to check once you reach the end of Halruaa and make a debugging save (just load up AR9799.ARE in your save - delete one of the entrances - play game again - if it crashes, then report )

 

Till then, enjoy NeJ

[micbaldur]

It would be easy to check once you reach the end of Halruaa and make a debugging save (just load up AR9799.ARE in your save - delete one of the entrances - play game again - if it crashes, then report )

 

Till then, enjoy NeJ

Well CTD happened at BG1 back then, i have still have all archive saves from BG1 so it's easy to test with those.

 

I'll test this later tonight when i get back home.

[Creepin]

Well, when the v7 of NEJ comes out, you might wish to relook into this, but before that, you don't really have to. But if you care to do work now, you could ask Vlad the v7 from him in a PM, he is likely to give it to you.

Vlad lifting a finger to help megamod? Err... are we talking about the same Vlad, the one who intentionally build incompatibilities with other mods into his own?

[The Imp]

Vlad lifting a finger to help megamod? Err... are we talking about the same Vlad, the one who intentionally build incompatibilities with other mods into his own?

I wouldn't be so sure the intention was to build incompatibility intentionally, but more like make sure the stuff that was there, was as it should be, aka he preffered the other fixpack and it's enhancements in the game, and not the G3's, as they were counter productive with each other. In the time when the weidu didn't patch things.
Besides, it was Vlads mods, that were taken from him that were ported in worse state as the compatible with the times megamod, the BP. If you consern yourself with the history. Be how ever it is, there's two sides with this.

Edited by The Imp, 27 September 2015 - 10:47 AM.

[micbaldur]

@ Lollorian

 

I found my earlier found report about AR9799.ARE CTD, it's here.

 

I tested same thing with my current BWP and removed Exit9900. CTD happens when i travel from Gullykin to Ulcaster and end up at north-east corner of Ulcaster and cause is missing Exit9900. CTD didn't happen when i travel from west areas to Ulcaster.

 

Here's Baldur.err:

ASSERTION FAILED!
File: InfScreenWorldMap.cpp
Line: 3069

Exp: FALSE

Msg: Bad Area file, in area "AR9799" need entry point "Exit9900".
Run Debugger?

 

I tried and removed Exit0070 but could NOT get game to CTD, tried from several locations around Ulcaster. I don't know what defines where i end up at Ulcaster. Maybe it's not needed.

 

So think that this isn't issue anymore, i don't know what happened in my old BWP back in 2013. Can't investigate it anymore because that BWP is in BWP heaven, rest in peace.

 

Update:

 

Corrected misleading typo.

Edited by micbaldur, 28 September 2015 - 01:23 AM.

[Lollorian]

<blockquote class='ipsBlockquote'data-author="micbaldur" data-cid="581250" data-time="1443397311"><p>
I tried and removed Exit0070 but could get game CTD, tried from several locations around Ulcaster. I don't know what defines where i end up at Ulcaster. Maybe it's not needed.<br />
 <br />
So think that this isn't issue anymore, i don't know what happened in my old BWP back in 2013. Can't investigate it anymore because that BWP is in BWP heaven, rest in peace.</p></blockquote>
So it didn't CtD when you removed Exit0700? Your reply seems to suggest otherwise

PS: Sorry mobile fucked up formatting in the post

Edited by Lollorian, 27 September 2015 - 05:20 PM.

[micbaldur]

So it didn't CtD when you removed Exit0700? Your reply seems to suggest otherwise

PS: Sorry mobile fucked up formatting in the post

There might be typo which might lead to wrong conclusion.

 

And yes, game did not CTD when i removed Exit0700. I did't try all areas only close one around, above and below.

[Vonburen]

I used to run a full megamond install (keep in mind it was roughly 3 years ago) with every single mod out there and never experienced any incompatibility issues with NeJ (the only  setback I faced was while trying to get to the upper level of the five flagons inn while Hrothgar wasn't a party member, the game automatically killed my main character [because I started his quest and then dismissed him]). Of course Irenicus' dungeon was filled with modded npcs, but I guess it made it a bit more lively, lol.

The asian (and chinese mods) were the only major source of incompatibilities and slowdowns.

Edited by Vonburen, 28 September 2015 - 04:09 AM.

[The Imp]

I used to run a full megamond install (keep in mind it was roughly 3 years ago) with every single mod out there and never experienced any incompatibility issues with NeJ

Have you read this topic ? Do you undrestand why micbaldur writes these posts ? I'll give you a hint: It has nothing to do with the question; "Can the game be played through somehow?" There are various decrees of compatibility, you seem to be talking about complete incompatibility... and were you even using the v691+694 NEJ ? -loads of other questions-
Now with that outset, should you understand what the topic is really about... It is mostly at least to find and eliminate everysingle compatibility issue micbaldur finds and can get them fixed and spread them to the rest of us, thanks to Lollorians patches, and other solutions. Nothing less. So hearing about how you had some run has nothing to do with this thread in my oppinion, so leaving it to that should be the end of it. It's 820 posts, that should tell you something about the support it does/has had to the games current moding scene.
Now if you wish to contribute, you can make your OWN thread, having installed a recent BWS game and make your own thread, if you find something that is not found and fixed already.

Yes, I am dissing you hard on this post because you probably miss understood the posts you read. Because you didn't have the time to go back enough. Yes, I am vulturing this thread mostly because... well, we Imps are evil. But there's other reasons too, that you probably will miss.
Thank you for understanding.

And yes, game did not CTD when i removed Exit0700. I did't try all areas only close one around, above and below.

... and just to glarify, you had made a debug save before entring to the area that has the entrance, that you loaded each time to test, correct ?

Edited by The Imp, 28 September 2015 - 05:44 AM.

[Lollorian]

@micbaldur: That confirms my suspicion that the patch isn't needed for v691

I'll do a test install and CLUA to AR9799 to check in the weekend

@Imp: Sheesh easy there man. The dude was probably trying to help. Also, I'd trust micbaldur knows by now about ARE files being stored in the save file

@Vonburen: Like the Imp mentioned, 3 yrs ago the BWP used to only have NeJ v42 but now we have v691... We'rw basically trying to determine if v42's shit is applicable for v691

Also maybe make NeJ play better with megamods with these bug reports

Edited by Lollorian, 28 September 2015 - 06:58 AM.

[Nightfarer]

@Lollorian.

 

Not sure if you read it, letting you know yesterday I replied you in personal conversation a couple of more things I tried to remember about the entrances, NeJ, BGT and the areas 

[Vlad]

NeJ has 3 problems:

 

1. NeJ locks Vulova Estate at Government and forces you to choose Bodhi at chapter 3. Easy to bypass by getting key to door. I made workaround for it.

 

2. NeJ removes Flametongue from Durlag's Tower area ARD014. Restored FlameTongue there.

 

3. After Halruaa you get stuck at Ulcaster (AR9799) in BG1 side and can't get back to BG2 side unless you CLUAConsole. Made workaround for it.

 

1. Well, it's locked in the original BG2 game unless you decide to do Bodhi's work and kill Vulova. NeJ doesn't re-lock it. In NeJ, you have the same standard choice. But Leina is available only if you work for Bodhi. So, I don't understand what's the problem. Just join Aran and that's all.

 

2. This is because improved Answerer+2 is added there. In addition, you may restore Vampiric Revenge.

 

3. This I don't know. Again, I've never encountered this issue in v6.91. As mentioned here, NeJ doesn't override BGT area files.

 

In AR0700, I needed to add a couple of triggers. Back in time, I couldn't do that with WeiDU.

 

[EDIT] Transition: Yes, I've introduced a new standard which seems good and reasonable. I don't understand why to take care of 100 NPCs, whom either don't exist or are not moved to BG2 including original BG1 NPCs? It doesn't make any sense. And with the release of new NPCs, this should be amended again and again. Party contains NPCs whom are moved plus a few more joinable from BG2. Now just add your NPCs there, items and that's all. Belt's dialogue file is amended only because of EraseJournal entries, but they may be moved to the script as well so not to touch his dialogue file. Maevar's cutscene is of course preserved.

 

I have added the Bank component to move gold from BG1 to BG2. It has never been a part of BGT or any other mod. It's incorporated in the quest of Aldeth.

 

Roxanne, if you want to make Sandrah story-wise compatible with NeJ3, you'll surely need to add a lot of banters and interjections with NeJ3 NPCs. This is what Bill is doing now with his NPC mod. There is a plenty of banters and interjections, and Sandrah will look dumb or broken without commenting or talking. So, you'll need of course to play NeJ3 instead of the mega mod with your Sandrah protagonist and write a bunch of new content. The result will be Sandrah NPC mod for NeJ3.

Edited by Vlad, 01 October 2015 - 04:01 AM.