81 replies to this topic

[Dakk]

Now, I give you an example of vanilla behaviour. Your character gets at time zero:
1. hit by a zombie - 1 damage per second for 60 sec
4. You have an item equipped with regeneration of 1 HP every 6 sec.

So instead of; 1 hp damage per second for 5 sec, 0 damage every 6 sec, repeat for 60 sec = 50 hp damage, you suffer the full disease effect for 60 seconds (60 hp damage)?
Fix!

[cmorgan]

the bigg, you use negative numbers in a certain range as .tra references from WeiDU. In my huge list of mods, I can find absolutely no mod at all that uses negative .tra references other than the few that adapt weidu install strings - so if ToBEX uses a relatively huge negative number range, it should be very future proof, right?

starting at (say) -100000000 and moving positive leaves an obscenely huge space if someone doesn't do research and just starts from the largest value and de-increments, and puts the largest number possible way, way outside of weidu range. Probably could move that a few decimal places in, too.

Edited by cmorgan, 03 February 2011 - 08:11 AM.

[DavidWallace]

@Ascension64: just to say I really appreciate how helpful you've been over this.

[Ascension64]

Can I please take all the 8-digit negative numbers?

[the bigg]

Ideally, we could have a 'reserved TRA entries' topic somewhere, so that the 5 people who need to reserve TRA references have a place to do so. Also, reserving all 8-digit negative numbers is overkill; perhaps you could take @-10000~@-20000?

Edited by the bigg, 04 February 2011 - 01:19 AM.

[Ascension64]

That'll do.

Anyway, I am still having trouble deciding what to do about the following three hacks. They currently sit in limbo...

Blindness Fix
Apply Casting Level Bonus
Enable PickpocketFailed Trigger

Edited by Ascension64, 04 February 2011 - 03:55 AM.

[the bigg]

Blindness: I have no strong opinion on the matter, but IMHO applying the effect as per spell description (without stacking the penalties) should be the default (again, by the 'description = intent' criterion of the Fixpack).

Apply Casting Level Bonus: does the opcode do anything in vanilla? If not, then it's clearly a fix and should be made to work by default, otherwise, it depends on what it did in vanilla and if any mod is willingly using its vanilla effect rather than the IESDP effect.

Enable PickPocketing: it should be off by default (and not send Attacked() if enabled). This way, vanilla blue-circled mobs go hostile if you fail to pick pocket them, and the relevant component of <mod> will continue to work (without having mobs go hostile because it still sends Attacked()).

[DavidWallace]

Blindness: I have no strong opinion on the matter, but IMHO applying the effect as per spell description (without stacking the penalties) should be the default (again, by the 'description = intent' criterion of the Fixpack).

Agreed - but this one might be usefully left accessible by third-party mods, as it would be natural to offer the alternative resolution as an optional tweak. (Obviously, that adds one to the set of might-be-on, might-be-off options, which I appreciate is something to keep from being as large as possible.)

Apply Casting Level Bonus: does the opcode do anything in vanilla? If not, then it's clearly a fix and should be made to work by default, otherwise, it depends on what it did in vanilla and if any mod is willingly using its vanilla effect rather than the IESDP effect.

Agreed.

Enable PickPocketing: it should be off by default (and not send Attacked() if enabled). This way, vanilla blue-circled mobs go hostile if you fail to pick pocket them, and the relevant component of <mod> will continue to work (without having mobs go hostile because it still sends Attacked()).

Agreed.

(Sorry, very sycophantic post.)

[Demivrgvs]

Blindness: I have no strong opinion on the matter, but IMHO applying the effect as per spell description (without stacking the penalties) should be the default (again, by the 'description = intent' criterion of the Fixpack).

I'd like to point out this "fix" would cause a sort of "compatibility issue" with SR, and possibly with any other spell mod (e.g. Spellpack?). Right know I've corrected all the descriptions to match vanilla's opcode (if I'm not wrong this wasn't addressed by Fixpack, was it?), and if the intended behaviour is restored I need to know it (aka SR needs to take that into account) or the fixed descriptions would suddenly become "unfixed".

I have no particular preference between -10 thac0 and -4 thac0/AC, but if you ask me this is an unnecessary fix, unlike making multiple blindness opcode not stack, which is indeed a must.

Apply Casting Level Bonus: does the opcode do anything in vanilla? If not, then it's clearly a fix and should be made to work by default, otherwise, it depends on what it did in vanilla and if any mod is willingly using its vanilla effect rather than the IESDP effect.

I'm currently using Taimon's code to make this opcode work. I use it in the upcoming IR V3 for both Potion of Power (to make it grant +2 to caster lvl as per PnP) and Amulet of Power. Is there any difference bewteen the two fixes? The opcode didn't worked at all in vanilla, thus fixing it by default should be fine as long as it works as inteded.

[the bigg]

I'm currently using Taimon's code to make this opcode work. I use it in the upcoming IR V3 for both Potion of Power (to make it grant +2 to caster lvl as per PnP) and Amulet of Power. Is there any difference bewteen the two fixes? The opcode didn't worked at all in vanilla, thus fixing it by default should be fine as long as it works as inteded.

From ToBEx's docs:

-----50 Apply Casting Level Bonus [C, M]
(Identical to tob_hacks)
Applies CASTINGLEVELBONUSMAGE and CASTINGLEVELBONUSCLERIC bonuses when casting spells

Options:
-0: disabled
-1: enabled

As such, you can either leave in Taimon's code (which won't cause problems if both tobex and the exe patch is installed), or remove the exe patch and switch to providing ToBEx's DLL yourself.

[Galactygon]

I'd like to point out this "fix" would cause a sort of "compatibility issue" with SR, and possibly with any other spell mod (e.g. Spellpack?). Right know I've corrected all the descriptions to match vanilla's opcode (if I'm not wrong this wasn't addressed by Fixpack, was it?), and if the intended behaviour is restored I need to know it (aka SR needs to take that into account) or the fixed descriptions would suddenly become "unfixed".

I have no particular preference between -10 thac0 and -4 thac0/AC, but if you ask me this is an unnecessary fix, unlike making multiple blindness opcode not stack, which is indeed a must.

I think it's a fix; if you want -10 penalties you can ask for the blindness opcode stat penalties to be externalized. It looks like the only solution that will satisfy everyone; otherwise I'm indifferent to this being externalized.

-Galactygon

[Ascension64]

Alright, so I think we have it.

Blindness Fix
Split into two.
1. Prevent cumulative -10 THAC0 penalty will be a fix
2. Restore to spell description will be a tweak (this will trump the fix if enabled)


Apply Casting Level Bonus
I'll clarify whether this is used in vanilla. If not, then 'extension'. If it is, tweak.

Enable PickPocketFailed trigger
Tweak.

Thanks for your input.

Edited by Ascension64, 04 February 2011 - 01:23 PM.

[DavidWallace]

I've slotted v18 into my local version of SCSII and it works just fine - exactly what I had in mind.

Regarding language support: it looks to me as if only two strings from the ToBEx tra file actually are visible in game: "critical hit averted" and "spell cancelled...". You could out-source the task of translating them to the INCLUDEing mod. So before I INCLUDE tobex.tpa, I could do

STRING_SET ~20696~ @3394 // critical hit averted
STRING_SET ~46529~ @3395 // spell cancelled

and you could drop the STRING_SET lines from ToBEx. Or, if you'd rather, I could do

OUTER_SPRINT ~tobex_crit_averted~ @3394
OUTER_SPRINT ~tobex_spell_cancelled~ @3395

and you could slot those variables into the relevant slots in ToBEx. (I think the first is simpler). Either way, the task of doing language support devolves to me and in turn to my translators.

This would be very inefficient if there were dozens or hundreds of player-visible lines in ToBEx. But there are only 2, and it doesn't seem likely (at least in the core, non-tweak version) that there are ever going to be very many more.

[GeN1e]

Apply Casting Level Bonus
I'll clarify whether this is used in vanilla. If not, then 'extension'. If it is, tweak.

I'd say it's fix, especially if it's used somewhere in vanilla. Otherwise either fix or extension, no difference.

PS Ah, got it - it could have some working effect in vanilla, different from what IESDP says.

Edited by GeN1e, 06 February 2011 - 03:21 AM.

[Ascension64]

Apply Casting Level Bonus
I'll clarify whether this is used in vanilla. If not, then 'extension'. If it is, tweak.

I'd say it's fix, especially if it's used somewhere in vanilla. Otherwise either fix or extension, no difference.

PS Ah, got it - it could have some working effect in vanilla, different from what IESDP says.

Looks like the IESDP description is correct. It ain't used. So, fix. This will move into the Effect Opcodes section and rename to Casting Level Modifer Fix.

[Ascension64]

You are referring to the SURGEMOD stat, I believe.

[phordicus]

i would like to see a pie chart describing each feature (fix/tweak/enhancement/happyending) and what mods will be activating it.

[DavidWallace]

i would like to see a pie chart describing each feature (fix/tweak/enhancement/happyending) and what mods will be activating it.

Are you offering to produce it?

[phordicus]

Are you offering to produce it?

i might! i'm still gathering intel on the various factions.