141 replies to this topic

[10th]

It deletes the invitation to the duke's palace from Krystin for example.

Another issue is //Correct price for Protection Cloak +1 (was: 5000 is now: 500). It was always worth 5000.

Moreover why install an outdated mod at all?
Additionally shouldn't it be up to ourselves if we want to have/not have "overpowered" items?
I can only speak for myself, but even if you have those "overpowered" items, you will get your ass handed to you more than once if you do a tactical SCS I+II install.

10th

Edited by 10th, 26 September 2010 - 04:33 PM.

[Miloch]

Another issue is //Correct price for Protection Cloak +1 (was: 5000 is now: 500). It was always worth 5000.

I suspect you have something like the "store prices" from Aurora or the Hard Times mod installed?

Moreover why install an outdated mod at all?

One could argue most mods are outdated, as very few are still actively maintained. But BP Balancer is known to be buggy and out of maintenance - I thought they removed it actually.

Additionally shouldn't it be up to ourselves if we want to have/not have "overpowered" items?

It is up to you - you can choose whichever mods and components you want with the BWS "further customisation" options, or edit your batch file if you're not using BWS. I don't think anyone's forcing a mod on you.

[Hoppy]

Would be helpful if someone would maintain that package.
I know someone wanted to create a new balancer some time ago... think it was OneEyedPhoenix.

Critical (for Russian users)
Russian install stalls because there's no line that tests for essential (Russian) BWP-files.

Yeah, him and MM75 were spearheading that. Haven't heard much about it in a while

Edited by Hoppy, 26 September 2010 - 08:47 PM.

[Lollorian]

Aside from the Duchal palace invite thing, the balancer also seems to delete a quest-related dagger from BoneHill

Maybe OEP and mm75 have a private workroom or something ... hey, we can still keep our hopes up right?? ... RIGHT?!?!? Personally, I never used the balancer's item-related components - but that doesn't mean I ignore any imba itemz I find

Edited by Lollorian, 27 September 2010 - 08:42 AM.

[the bigg]

I can only speak for myself, but even if you have those "overpowered" items, you will get your ass handed to you more than once if you do a tactical SCS I+II install.

I don't think so - DavidW said that SCS/II is designed for the 'standard' BG2, rather than for a game with all overpowered item mods ever created. Of course, BWP Tactical is full of mods adding overpowered items and battles that are built for a party with those items, so in BWP-T those overpowered items might be needed and/or highly recommended.

[dabus]

Another "Install.bat hangs itself-issue" for Russian users

[DavidWallace]

I can only speak for myself, but even if you have those "overpowered" items, you will get your ass handed to you more than once if you do a tactical SCS I+II install.

I don't think so - DavidW said that SCS/II is designed for the 'standard' BG2, rather than for a game with all overpowered item mods ever created.

Yep: SCS is balanced with the original game in mind.

Having said that, difficulty is very player-relative. SCS, ultimately, is scaled to me: i.e., I find the game about the right difficulty with SCS installed, on Core difficulty, and with no item-enhancing mods installed. (And I think I'm a reasonable but not outstanding tactical player, who's been through the game about three times and who knows the AD&D system pretty well but isn't all that on top of the detailed ways to optimise a BG2 runthrough.) It's too easy for some people. It's too hard for others (by which I mean: too hard for playing BG2 to be fun, not necessarily too hard to be completed full stop.) So maybe there are people out there who want SCS AI (maybe because they dislike stupid behaviour) but then also want overpowered weapons to bring the difficulty down. That's fine with me.

[Lollorian]

So maybe there are people out there who want SCS AI (maybe because they dislike stupid behaviour) but then also want overpowered weapons to bring the difficulty down. That's fine with me.

THAT ... should be stickied!

[Miloch]

So maybe there are people out there who want SCS AI (maybe because they dislike stupid behaviour) but then also want overpowered weapons to bring the difficulty down. That's fine with me.

THAT ... should be stickied!

The funny thing is that this same modder recently made a comment (and a very valid one) that this sort of thing leads to a vicious circle. The more powerful (or intelligent) your monsters, the more powerful your weapons need to be to defeat them, so you give the monsters the weapons to make them even more powerful to stand up to your (at this point) demonic arsenal, then at this point the now godlike enemies are now practically undefeatable unless you have a hydrogen bomb or something. Which some modder has probably implemented in their overpowered and out-of-character mod .

Thing is, overpowered = overpowered by definition. "Powerful" is a different story - obviously there are powerful (and probably even overpowered) weapons even in the unmodded game. As well there should be for a high-level game, but not ridiculous or all over the place.

Getting somewhat back on topic, I thought the old BP Balancer had different options originally, like one not to mess with quest items at all, but only to nuke excessive multiple copies of regular magic weapons, or something like that? It's been a while since I looked at it though.

And yes, OneEyedPhoenix was looking at revising or making a new BP Balancer but that was a while back and he hasn't been around much. I doubt there's a private forum or anything.

[Lollorian]

Line 2130 in the install.bat

Call %INST% ACBre "0" "TYPE ACBre_input.txt"

is missing an %IFG% (unless it got a secret eng traslate somehow )

Edited by Lollorian, 29 September 2010 - 03:18 AM.

[Marvin]

Well, in a BWP Standard install with some tactic-components (such as CSC + SCSII) I don't use xpmod and the experience settings for spell learning, disarming traps and pick pocket is at 50%. Fpr the BGI portion of the game this is perfectly fine. If I find "clearly overpowered" items, I just don't buy them ( but I think they should really be removed from a standard BWP install).

I can't tell, though, how these settings are going to work out for the BGII version of the game. I do however think that DavidWallace's intentions should count as the "standard" for the BWP. I'm an experienced BG player, but not a tactical genious. I never bothered getting into the exact rules for ADND and even BG or BG2. It somehow always worked out great for me.


The challenge is: fining xp-settings for the BWP, which ensure a difficulty level that is equal to the difficulty of a vanilla game + SCS (SCSII). This should then be the "Standard" or "recommended" difficulty setting. Everything else would be up to each individual player. I know that this is easier said than done and I myself hav no idea of how to do such a thing or if it's even possible. But maybe some of the experienced modders does have a solution.

[Lollorian]

Line 2130 in the install.bat

Call %INST% ACBre "0" "TYPE ACBre_input.txt"

is missing an %IFG% (unless it got a secret eng translate somehow )

In addition to Breager, there's Ascalon's questpack and a host of german/spanish NPC mods that get installed in an english-only game

... and the french Severian mod as well

Edited by Lollorian, 29 September 2010 - 03:36 AM.

[the bigg]

The challenge is: fining xp-settings for the BWP, which ensure a difficulty level that is equal to the difficulty of a vanilla game + SCS (SCSII). This should then be the "Standard" or "recommended" difficulty setting. Everything else would be up to each individual player. I know that this is easier said than done and I myself hav no idea of how to do such a thing or if it's even possible. But maybe some of the experienced modders does have a solution.

I think it's impossible to guarantee a similar level of difficulty between different mod combinations. The killer problem is that, even if you use DEFJAM to nullify the extra XP you gain from mods' quests (a bad idea, because you then spend two hours killing enemies and doing quests without dinging a single level), Big Mods add tons of overpowered items, and the only real way to balance them out is to remove them from the game (possibly breaking quests).

Edited by the bigg, 29 September 2010 - 04:05 AM.

[jastey]

There is a discussion goin on here (German) about mods that might be inappropriate in the Standard installation, for several reasons. Overpowered item / store mods is one category discussed.

[Usurper]

How much work would it be to get this script to run on linux with GemRB?

[Fennek]

Regarding Jastey's post:
I guess I will set up the same dicussion here.
http://www.shsforums...d-installation/

[DavidWallace]

So maybe there are people out there who want SCS AI (maybe because they dislike stupid behaviour) but then also want overpowered weapons to bring the difficulty down. That's fine with me.

THAT ... should be stickied!

Though it's probably worth noting that almost anything is fine with me. Using CTRL-Y whenever a fight gets boring is fine with me. Cheating yourself to 30th level is fine with me. I really don't mind how you use SCS, and even if I did mind, I don't see why you should care that I do.

So maybe there are people out there who want SCS AI (maybe because they dislike stupid behaviour) but then also want overpowered weapons to bring the difficulty down. That's fine with me.

THAT ... should be stickied!

The funny thing is that this same modder recently made a comment (and a very valid one) that this sort of thing leads to a vicious circle. The more powerful (or intelligent) your monsters, the more powerful your weapons need to be to defeat them, so you give the monsters the weapons to make them even more powerful to stand up to your (at this point) demonic arsenal, then at this point the now godlike enemies are now practically undefeatable unless you have a hydrogen bomb or something. Which some modder has probably implemented in their overpowered and out-of-character mod

The only thing I'd say to this is that there's a distinction (albeit, not a totally precise one) between how powerful a monster is and how intelligent it is. SCS aims to make monsters as intelligent as possible. After that it makes some additional difficulty increases. The arms-race point is that if you install more powerful monsters and also more powerful items, not much really changes. But if you install more intelligent monsters and more powerful items, you might get a game that's no more difficult but is more interesting and immersive.

I'm not particularly recommending this - it's just speculation on my part.

[the bigg]

Though it's probably worth noting that almost anything is fine with me. Using CTRL-Y whenever a fight gets boring is fine with me. Cheating yourself to 30th level is fine with me. I really don't mind how you use SCS, and even if I did mind, I don't see why you should care that I do.

I'd assume because it's refreshing to see modders who don't delete threads where people ask for advice or defame/ban people that play their mods not following the officially sanctioned mod's rules.

Edited by the bigg, 29 September 2010 - 07:11 AM.

[dabus]

@Lol:

Regarding Foreign languages in English install.

[dabus]

Note:
DSOA component 1 may be installed twice.

%IFTNS%BPv180.exe Call %INST% DSoA "1 3 5 7"
%IFT% Call %INST% DSoA "1 4 6 8"

Kontweak component 0 and Atweaks have conflicts in batch, in PDF there's this:

Don't install any of the Wizard Slayer components together with Ashes of Embers, Grey Acumen's Kit Improvements, RPG Dungeon Kitpack or Kitanya NPC mods because they also alter the wizard slayer kit.

BPv180 component 16 may be installed twice.

%IFT% Call %INST% BPv180 "16"
%IFN% BWP_No_BP_AI Call %INST% BPv180 "16 17 18 19 20 21"

Edited by dabus, 03 October 2010 - 06:00 AM.