24 replies to this topic

[Dennis]

Well, after being away from Baldur's Gate for a few years, I came back and found the Big World Project.

I installed the Big World Project (medium version). So far I have been having a blast playing through Baldur's Gate; I am just now wondering around a collecting a party.

EDIT 1: I have decided to make one thread and report whatever oddities I encounter here.


Oddity #1: I recently noticed that in-game in the Character Record my 3rd level fighter is listed as having a base THACO of 20. When I look at the character in Near Infinity my fighter has a base THACO of 18 (which is what it should be).

My character is low enough level that I am not noticing any serious errors in how often I am hitting. Further more, I am not sure the game is treating my character as though the THACO is wrong. As I say, in Near Infinity the character record has the correct value.

I am simply mentioning it here as the Big World Project thread requests that people report In-Game Errors, and this is an In-Game Error (at least a display error and possibly a combat statistic error).

Anyway, having a blast so far and I expect I will keep having a blast. Thanks to all concerned parties: those who wrote the mods and those who made the Big World Project.

Thanks and take care,

Dennis

Edited by Dennis, 28 July 2010 - 11:37 PM.

[Jarno Mikkola]

...

There's many modifiers that can effect the end result that your character has in their character sheet, so the question actually comes what those are. Potions, spells, statistics, proficiency points(yes, the 1 star is actually the normal zero effect usability, so if your proficiency is not 1 or more stars, you actually have penalty!), fatigue, kit and few other things, but those should cover most.

[Dennis]

Ach. My last post was as a guest, so now I am double posting. Oh well.

Well, clearly there are more modifiers involved than I can see since for the two characters where I attempted to work out Base THACO and THACO, as far as I could tell Base THACO was off for both, and so was THACO. As near as I could tell THACO was not equal to Base THACO adjusted for the modifiers OR what should have been the Base THACO adjusted for the modifiers. Conclusion: I don't know what all the modifiers are.

Ah well, as long as I function reasonably well in combat I'm not going to lose any sleep over this.

Have a good day all,

Dennis

[Eric P.]

It's THAC0, not THACO

Base THAC0 depends on character class/level. Adjustments go from there, first from DEX (if any modifier), then from any number of other factors, as mentioned above, such as situational, kit, weapon enhancement, etc.

This probably doesn't help...but then I don't understand the distinction here between "base THAC0" and "actual THAC0."

- E

[Dennis]

On the in-game Character Record page, if you go through the details of a character there are two consecutive entries. The first is called Base THAC0, which I presume is the base number based on class and level, and the second is called THAC0, which I assumed was the base number modified by all applicable modifiers. This is not my distinction, it is one built into the game.

For some reason, neither number is what I expect. However, THAC0 is uniformly lower than base THAC0, which seems reasonable enough.

Anyway, while I don't understand the numbers, I am not terribly worried about them.

Cheers

Dennis

[Jarno Mikkola]

Anyway, while I don't understand the numbers, I am not terribly worried about them.

Well, the probable reason is that you have a kit that you do not understand...
As the Base Thac0 is the base Thac0 the class has, that comes from the file called "Thac0.2da"... now, the question is; What kit are you using? ...and what class is that kit based on? As for example, if you have you characters base class is sorcerer, but you have a kit on that, things might look weird... yes, the base game didn't have such features, but that's just the base game and it's all weird from there on out.

[Dennis]

Well, too be sure I am not 100% sure about the effects of kits and, sure enough, my protaganist has one.

My protaganist is an Elven Fighter (3) / Thief (4) / Mage (3) with the Berserker kit (one of the basic fighter classes in BGII - SoA).

He was created with Ctl-8 so his attributes are 18s except for Str which is 18 / 100.

On the Character Record page his Base THAC0 is 20 and his THAC0 (with a Katana which he has specialization in) is 15. I wonder if someone programed a bonus to strike with Katanas for Elves into the game. That would make 3 for Strength, 1 for Specialization, and 1 for being an Elf which would make a difference of 5 between the Base THAC0 and his THAC0. Or maybe Bersersker gives him a +1. Why his Base THAC0 is 20 is beyond me.

But as I say, I'm reallly not worried about this. It just seems weird and I thought someone else might have had the same experience. If multiple people have the experience it might be worth pursuing. If not, it doesn't seem worth putting much effort into.

Say, I am thinking that I made a mistake in starting one thread for the Thac0 Weirdness and another for Neville and his henchmen. I am thinking I should have just made one thread to report oddities in my game and put everything in it. Maybe I should start such a thread the next time I find something that seems odd.

[Jarno Mikkola]

On the Character Record page his Base THAC0 is 20 and his THAC0 (with a Katana which he has specialization in) is 15. I wonder if someone programed a bonus to strike with Katanas for Elves into the game. That would make 3 for Strength, 1 for Specialization, and 1 for being an Elf which would make a difference of 5 between the Base THAC0 and his THAC0. Or maybe Bersersker gives him a +1. Why his Base THAC0 is 20 is beyond me.

Well, does your character have a Katana in his hand? As they are quite hard to come by...

Say, I am thinking that I made a mistake in starting one thread for the Thac0 Weirdness and another for Neville and his henchmen. I am thinking I should have just made one thread to report oddities in my game and put everything in it. Maybe I should start such a thread the next time I find something that seems odd.

What comes to the topics... I would suggest to use just one... and if you have to, edit the first post in the topic, as then you can adjust the topics title too.

[Dakk]

an Elven Fighter (3) / Thief (4) / Mage (3) with the Berserker kit

I feel pretty confident stating this is your "problem"...
You'll never be able to calculate that THAC0 manually, and the game can report weird numbers from time to time, but mostly it'll work dandy (as in correctly).

[Dennis]

On the Character Record page his Base THAC0 is 20 and his THAC0 (with a Katana which he has specialization in) is 15. I wonder if someone programed a bonus to strike with Katanas for Elves into the game. That would make 3 for Strength, 1 for Specialization, and 1 for being an Elf which would make a difference of 5 between the Base THAC0 and his THAC0. Or maybe Bersersker gives him a +1. Why his Base THAC0 is 20 is beyond me.

Well, does your character have a Katana in his hand? As they are quite hard to come by...

Say, I am thinking that I made a mistake in starting one thread for the Thac0 Weirdness and another for Neville and his henchmen. I am thinking I should have just made one thread to report oddities in my game and put everything in it. Maybe I should start such a thread the next time I find something that seems odd.

What comes to the topics... I would suggest to use just one... and if you have to, edit the first post in the topic, as then you can adjust the topics title too.

He has a Katana because I liked the idea of the characer wielding a Katana and gave him one. In retrospect, probably not such a good idea as he has the Str to wield a Bastard Sword, it does equal damage, it is much cheaper, and since Bastard Swords were in the original BG1 I imagine it is possible to find a magical Bastard Sword, whereas by taking proficiency in Katana I may not get a magic weapon until the BG2 part of the game (though I suppose a mod might have added a magic Katana in BG1).

All right, I am consolidating into one thread for all my oddities.

an Elven Fighter (3) / Thief (4) / Mage (3) with the Berserker kit

I feel pretty confident stating this is your "problem"...
You'll never be able to calculate that THAC0 manually, and the game can report weird numbers from time to time, but mostly it'll work dandy (as in correctly).

Yes, that could be the problem. I am not sure. At all odds, I am not really worried about it.



Time to move on to Oddity #2:

Oddity #2 was in the Ogre's Reach area of the overland map with the bandit Neville the Fair and his (lack of) Henchmen. When I encountered Neville the Fair he declared that he and his men would attack me, and then stayed blue as my protaganist and his party killed him (with arrows and sling bullets). Furthermore, his henchmen never showed up at all. Not a real problem, but it did seem odd. Hence, I mention it in my oddities thread.

Edited by Dennis, 30 July 2010 - 07:58 PM.

[Ipsissimus]

The BG1 NPC Project adds a +2 Katana.

Spoiler

You can get it when you kill Caldo and Krumm, the two dimwits attacking the dryad's tree.

The weapon is cursed, though.

[Dennis]

The BG1 NPC Project adds a +2 Katana.

Spoiler

You can get it when you kill Caldo and Krumm, the two dimwits attacking the dryad's tree.

The weapon is cursed, though.

Well, while it was nice of whoever did the BG1 NPC Project to add a magic Katana, though I am not so sure I want a cursed weapon. Oh well, that's okay. Barring monsters where magic weapons are needed I should be able to get by with a non-magical Katana.

It'll work out. I should have magic available to deal with monsters I can't fight. And if all else fails I can run away.

Thanks, and cheers,

Dennis

[Dennis]

Pardon the double post, but it has been a couple of weeks since my last entry so I felt that perhaps a new post was appropriate.

Oddity #3:

I have just visited the map area "South of Wyrm's Crossing" and have just dealt with Sonner and his cronies.

I visited the house NE of where I met Sonner and found a woman named Leila within. She asked me to kill a "zombie" behind the house. Behind the house is nothing but water, and I have searched the area nearby quite thorougly without finding a "zombie" or indeed anyone else or any other sort of monster.

I went back to tell her that I would not kill the zombie (since I couldn't find it) and she begged me to "free her of the creature". But as I say, there seems to be no creature to free her from.

I will try to look into this further, but it seems like maybe this is something that is broken.

Cheers,

Dennis

[Fouinto]

[...]I have searched the area nearby quite thorougly without finding a "zombie" or indeed anyone else or any other sort of monster.

I met him very close from the house (and close to the water) under one of the trees (note : he is not supposed to attack).

Hope this helps.

Edited by Fouinto, 06 August 2010 - 12:41 AM.

[Dennis]

Thanks Fouinto. I searched near the house for the fifth or sixth time after resting and found him. I suspect I am simply too tired and shouldn't have been playing the game tonight. However, I have now found him so this particular oddity is over. Ever feel like you are missing perfectly obvious things because you are too tired. That is how I feel tonight. Sorry if I wasted anyone's time. And thanks to Fouinto (my search had moved rather away from the house).

Night all (about 3am where I am and I am calling it a night).

Dennis

[Dennis]

Well, again, a double post. But it has been a while since the last post, and this is on a new oddity, so I thought it would be appropriate to have a new post.

A new oddity; oddity #4.

I was exploring the Firewine Bridge area and encountered two lesser basilisks. In the battle (missiles v stoning), both lesser basilisks were destroyed, but two party members suffered severely. The first party member to suffer severely was Khalid who gained the Stunned status icon, was reduced to 1 hp, lost all of his equipment (that is, it was all on the ground at his location), and was completely unresponsive. I assumed he was petrified, but there was no such icon and he was still at 1 hp (is this was happens when you get petrified?). The second party member to suffer severely was my protagonist, who was similarly effected except that he was selectable, could have his equipment put back on, and could be healed. He could not, however, move, fire missiles, or cast spells. I let the game run for about half an hour after this happened and there was no change in the status of the characters.

After this I reloaded, and encountered a bunch of wolves which were okay to encounter. I'm just puzzled by what happened when Khalid and my protagonist got petrified (if that is what happened), and why they were not affected in the same way, and why the game didn't end when my lead character was petrified, and why they did not have the same status icons. Anyway, I am past this as I reloaded and moved on. I am just reporting something that was very odd.

Oh, and while talking about the Firewine Bridge let me add that Khaark (sp?) was much tougher than I remember him being; he killed me the first two times I tried fighting him, it took a third attempt before I was able to beat him. I am not sure if Khaark was upgraded, or had better AI, or what, but he was certainly tougher. I really kind of enjoyed having a much tougher Khaark to face.

Dennis

[Ieldra]

Here a possible insight into the problem "My L3 fighter has THAC0 20":

If you have "Full Plate and Packing Steel" installed, many shields have higher AC boni, but also increase your THAC0. If you're wielding a Large Shield, for instance, you get -5 to AC, but +2 to THAC0. The modifier is applied to base THAC0, unfortunately, so itit seems yoour 3rd level fighter will have a base THAC0 of 20.

[Jarno Mikkola]

Well, again, a double post. But it has been a while since the last post, and this is on a new oddity, so I thought it would be appropriate to have a new post.

It's actually better that you repost so you get a response.

A new oddity; oddity #4... petrified

Yes, the character was petrified, the reason is two of fixes in the install, one is P5Tweaks-mods "Drop Items on Petrification" and the other is The Bigg Tweak Pack v2.31 "Flesh to Stone Fix. (v2.10)" that permanently stuns and drops the HP to 1, instead of dropping the party member out of the party with those same effects.

Edited by Jarno Mikkola, 13 August 2010 - 07:54 AM.

[Dennis]

Here a possible insight into the problem "My L3 fighter has THAC0 20":

If you have "Full Plate and Packing Steel" installed, many shields have higher AC boni, but also increase your THAC0. If you're wielding a Large Shield, for instance, you get -5 to AC, but +2 to THAC0. The modifier is applied to base THAC0, unfortunately, so itit seems yoour 3rd level fighter will have a base THAC0 of 20.

Jackpot. My Thac0 was two points off and I was using a Large Shield. I think you have hit the nail on the head. Thanks so much.

Well, again, a double post. But it has been a while since the last post, and this is on a new oddity, so I thought it would be appropriate to have a new post.

It's actually better that you repost so you get a response.

A new oddity; oddity #4... petrified

Yes, the character was petrified, the reason is two of fixes in the install, one is P5Tweaks-mods "Drop Items on Petrification" and the other is The Bigg Tweak Pack v2.31 "Flesh to Stone Fix. (v2.10)" that permanently stuns and drops the HP to 1, instead of dropping the party member out of the party with those same effects.

Well, the use of a new post for a new topic seems appropriate for a couple of reasons then.

Aha. Now I know how Petrification works in BWP courtesy of P5Tweaks and The Bigg Tweak Pack. I guess I should distribute some Stone to Flesh scrolls about the party in order to undo this effect should it happen to me again in future. Thanks for the information. Nice to have an alternative to reloading just because the protaganist gets zapped with a petrification attack.

Thanks all,

Dennis