11 replies to this topic

[Satori]

I was thinking of writing a fanfic for BG and i wondered how high level Thalantyr is. Or how important he is. I don't want to be portraying him as an archmage if he's a big fish in a small pond but not all that impressive in the big picture.

About how high level are wizards who have flesh golems around to defend their homes?

[Lollorian]

According to my (heavily modified BWP-BGT-Megamod install ) BGII game

Thalantyr - Human Male Enchanter

Level - 11

STR - 12
DEX - 13
CON - 14
INT - 19
WIS - 17
CHA - 14

But, vanilla BGI stats

Thalantyr - Human Male Mage

Level - 11

STR - 12
DEX - 13
CON - 14
INT - 17
WIS - 17
CHA - 14

Cheers,
Lol

Edited by Lollorian, 12 October 2009 - 09:34 PM.

[Miloch]

Well he must be important because somehow he got his paws on the Claw and Horn of Kazgaroth, possibly some of the most powerful artifacts in western Faerun, and last known to be in the Moonshae Isles per Doug Niles' books (might make a cool mod to explain how he got hold of them).

[Lollorian]

Actually, that's a pretty cool idea for a sorta "Mysteries of Faerun" mod Could connect all the loose stories and stuff that BGI has tons of

Hmm, let's see, Thalantyr's Kazgaroth connection, the Balduran mystery, the Firewine episode, what "actually" happened at Ulcaster .... and if you're up for crossmod, "Who ARE the overlords they mention in Secret of BoneHill"

Cheers,
Lol

[Satori]

Well he must be important because somehow he got his paws on the Claw and Horn of Kazgaroth, possibly some of the most powerful artifacts in western Faerun, and last known to be in the Moonshae Isles per Doug Niles' books (might make a cool mod to explain how he got hold of them).

Uhm, the items don't appear to be *that* important. Kazgaroth's heart is a minor artifact, but we don't know what it does. His Claws and Horn aren't even artifacts, AFAIK.

I know that D&D 3.5 goes to level 20, and uses "EPIC" rules afterwards. is there and equivalent break-point on AD&D2.0?

[Miloch]

Uhm, the items don't appear to be *that* important. Kazgaroth's heart is a minor artifact, but we don't know what it does. His Claws and Horn aren't even artifacts, AFAIK.

Well, the Heart of Kazgaroth was definitely one of the most evil artifacts ever. According to the books (Villians Lorebook 2e FR supplement etc.) the Heart in the hands of an evil cleric was a direct link to Bhaal (yeah maybe he's "dead" now but in the FR no god is truly ever irreversibly dead now, are they). It provides instant replenshment of spells and the ability to raise hundreds or even thousands of undead to serve the holder in an army - a sort of supremely powerful Animate Dead cast by Bhaal himself. It also has the ability to corrupt fully "good" clerics and even neutral druids into evil priests in Bhaal's service.

Kazgaroth itself was a beastlike minion of Bhaal with practically godlike abilities in its own right. It can take any form and permanently charm nearly any being or even mass charm them. It can only be killed permanently by the long-lost Sword of Cymrych Hugh. Otherwise I believe its Horn or perhaps even the Claw could resurrect the Beast. So if not the most powerful, they definitely have to be among the most feared artifacts. My idea about the Horn was that since it sucks the life force of the user, if the Horn is fully drained, it becomes a permanent fixture of the former user, who actually becomes Kagaroth resurrected. Of course, that's not how it is in the vanilla game though, but it'd be more true to the lorebooks.

I know that D&D 3.5 goes to level 20, and uses "EPIC" rules afterwards. is there and equivalent break-point on AD&D2.0?

2e goes to level 20 normally - the High-Level Campaigns supplement goes to 30, after which advancement stops, though a character can seek out special quests after that, perhaps eventually leading to divine ascension.

As for Thalantyr, there's a profile on him in Volo's Guide to the Sword Coast:

Thalantyr the Conjurer (NG human wizard level 17; Int 17, Wiz 17).
An archmage of note, Thalantyr is a courtly, solitary man who enjoys walks in the countryside while armed with his staff of power. He dwells in a griffon-guarded estate known as High Hedge, northwest of Beregost.

Once an adventurer who eagerly sought the lost magic of Netheril in crumbling ruins, he's retired from the perils of that profession, though he'll help other adventurers (though not his former advetnuring companions) with advice and spells for fees. He'll also warn them that they may find a lot more than they intended to, as he did - but won't be much more specific.

One gathers from long conversations with him that he met some sort of horrible monster and was enslaved for a time, escaping only through luck. He is said to have won his freedom with spellbooks and other magical relics of Netheril that make him self-supporting, so that he need not travel the planes or go adventuring in Toril any longer.

[Lollorian]

... Heart of Kazgaroth ...
... Kazgaroth ...
... Bhaal's minion ...
... Sword of Cymrych Hugh ...

... Volo's Guide to the Sword Coast ...
... some sort of horrible monster and was enslaved for a time ...
... Netheril ...

WOW!!! That's almost enough content for a mod based on Thalantyr's chronicles (I'm just throwing this out there but the guide seems to heavily imply that the "horrible monster" was Kazgaroth )

On a side note, Volo's Guide seems to imply that Thalantyr was severely nerfed to level 11 (probably cause BGI didn't support the kinda levels BGII-ToB has )

But, i guess if BGT uses the BGII engine to its advantage, might as well use the expanded level table for the more powerful (but nerfed-a-lot) guys in BGI <goes to check Elminister's BGI stats> )

Cheers,
Lol

[Jarno Mikkola]

As for Thalantyr, there's a profile on him in Volo's Guide to the Sword Coast:

Thalantyr the Conjurer (NG human wizard level 17; Int 17, Wiz 17).
An archmage of note, Thalantyr is a courtly, solitary man who enjoys walks in the countryside while armed with his staff of power. He dwells in a griffon-guarded estate known as High Hedge, northwest of Beregost.

Once an adventurer who eagerly sought the lost magic of Netheril in crumbling ruins, he's retired from the perils of that profession, though he'll help other adventurers (though not his former advetnuring companions) with advice and spells for fees. He'll also warn them that they may find a lot more than they intended to, as he did - but won't be much more specific.

One gathers from long conversations with him that he met some sort of horrible monster and was enslaved for a time, escaping only through luck. He is said to have won his freedom with spellbooks and other magical relics of Netheril that make him self-supporting, so that he need not travel the planes or go adventuring in Toril any longer.

Mod idea: Let's put a few neutral wyverns alike Griffons to this bad @$$ door and give him the Claws and Horn into his inventory, so somebody can rob him, if they dare, alike the Permidion Stark says you could.

<goes to check Elminister's BGI stats>

No need, he is 49 level mage, 50th level 'innocent'.

Edited by Jarno Mikkola, 14 October 2009 - 02:39 AM.

[Lollorian]

No need, he is 49 level mage, 50th level 'innocent'.

I don't think the second level type applies to his "Class = INNOCENT"

But, you're kinda wrong too He's 29/30 in me vanilla BGI install ... and gets changed to 12/12/12 in the BGII (mega) game (now if only someone could tell me what the 3 levels mean Fighter/Thief/Mage???)

And look at what he has ... A quarterstaff?? WHERE's his pipe?!?!? Someone really needs to give these guys some real power :phear:

Oh, and if someone does go about creating a mod that revisits Thalantyr's chronicles, maybe it could be expanded to include some other guys, maybe an area like the WoW Caverns of Time or something (I dunno if some other mod already has this kinda thing though )

Btw ... Even if Jarno was joking (i think ) his wyvern and inventory ideas also sound great.

(some of this threads posts should be moved to IE Mod Ideas, dontcha think?? )

Cheers,
Lol

Edited by Lollorian, 14 October 2009 - 06:51 AM.

[Sam.]

There is a mod, possibly DSoSC or The Vault, that adds 2 stone golems to Thalantyr's guards. There is another that adds a quest where the mayor of Nashkel asks you go to Thalantyr with the Vile of Mysterious Liquid to get an antidote made (to reverse its effect on the ore).

I always thought that the Baldur's Gate games played down the capabilities of most of the famous powers-- Elminster, Gorion, Thalantyr, Shandalar, Tethtoril, Ulraunt, etc. The exception being Drizzt in BG1, though he was made almost pathetic in BGII. (Tethtoril and Ulraunt do have close to a thousand HP each, but nothing else-- no equipment or spells or anything. Ulraunt is supposed to have a staff of the magi if I recall correctly.)

[Miloch]

But, you're kinda wrong too He's 29/30 in me vanilla BGI install ...

It means he's a level 29 mage, in theory, though he has no spells as such. A step away from potential divine ascension (in standard 2e rules anyway). The 30 in the "level 2" field means nothing unless he was dual-classed, which he wasn't, because there is no "original class" flag set.

And look at what he has ... A quarterstaff?? WHERE's his pipe?!?!? Someone really needs to give these guys some real power

I always thought that the Baldur's Gate games played down the capabilities of most of the famous powers-- Elminster, Gorion, Thalantyr, Shandalar, Tethtoril, Ulraunt, etc. The exception being Drizzt in BG1, though he was made almost pathetic in BGII. (Tethtoril and Ulraunt do have close to a thousand HP each, but nothing else-- no equipment or spells or anything. Ulraunt is supposed to have a staff of the magi if I recall correctly.)

You can't kill these guys, so there's no point to giving them power gear or spells or even 1000 HP, though I suppose they did that "just in case". I think there's enough of that with being able to kill Drizzt, though it is nice conceptually to be able to waste at least *one* of these superpower FR munchkin types - not for the items which are definitely imba but just for the fun. Maybe an idea for Mod for the Wicked or something if it ever progresses, but other than that, there's zero point to fleshing out these guys. Yeah, maybe they could join your party temporarily or something too, but there's enough NPC mods.

WoW

Btw ... Even if Jarno was joking (i think ) his wyvern and inventory ideas also sound great.

Wyverns are more like mini dragons - they don't look anything like griffins which are eagle/lion crosses. Maybe an IWD harpy animation or something, though that's not really that similar either. As for putting the artifacts in his inventory - why? He's selling them, so they're in his store instead (and you can steal them either way, unless that's disabled, which it probably should be in his case).

[Satori]

I'm afraid I'm putting poor Thalanty through the ringer again.

Going on an Adventure