15 replies to this topic

[Uriel]

I just thought of this last night. How about a discussion between Tashia, an elf, and a non-elf PC about the differences in their respective lifespans? Tashia, barring any external factors, will most certainly outlive a non-elf PC.

I got this idea from one of the later Drizzt novels, when Bruenor reminds Drizzt that he's an elf, and Cattie Brie is a human, and that he'd outlive her.

Any thoughts?

[Bri]

That's not a bad idea. Heh, I actually considered that for a discussion if one romanced Aerie or Viconia for example (note that I don't recall the lifespans of Half-Elves being too much longer than humans....) so, I will probably do that after the other ideas...if I can get my mind working...

[Uriel]

Heh, just updated my sig.

Wow, what can I say, what a quick reply! Oh, and I'm glad you like my idea. It feels good to contribute, no matter how small or insignificant it is.

Currently I'm not playing BGII anymore, I'm waiting in anticipation for the improved Tashia mod. From the looks of it, the quality of the improvements will be worth the wait

Passing the time, between posting and viewing the 'net, getting re-addicted to the excellent Thief series.

Uriel

[Razorback]

It would be hard to fully consider it though, no one really knows how old Viconia, Aerie, or Jaheira is. In most of the ending story lines in ToB, they say that the Pc and the elven lover live and die -together- (or grow old together, you get the idea). I think in the BG series they treat elven years the same as human years.

[Bri]

To RazorbacK:
It is true that BioWare handled elf years similar to human years (for that matter the same with dwarf and gnome years...) but Aerie does make a comment to Jaheira, for example during one of the romantic banters (initiated by Jaheira, with Aerie interrupting) where Aerie states "I'm older than you most likely"

So, BioWare kinda worked it both ways...they made it the same in some instances, then referenced the Pen and Paper differences...but there was that instant in ToB where Aerie has a dream of her and the main PC growing old together...and I thought "Wait a minute...I'm human...she will still be young when I'm cold in the ground barring some strong magicks..."

And yeah, Uriel, I restarted playing it full time again after downloading the Chloe module (just released) and the Kiara-Ziaya module...

Well, Tashia did need some updating as for content...she was still good, but definitely could use some fleshing out...

[Razorback]

So, BioWare kinda worked it both ways...they made it the same in some instances, then referenced the Pen and Paper differences...but there was that instant in ToB where Aerie has a dream of her and the main PC growing old together...and I thought "Wait a minute...I'm human...she will still be young when I'm cold in the ground barring some strong magicks..."

Yea, that was what I was referring to for the most part. Elves usually live to be 280+ years while human pcs don't live much longer than maybe 100 if you're lucky. (or if you have a chance to become a chosen of a god like Elminster and live for about a thousand years )

[Bri]

*nods* In 2nd Edition D&D most elves can live up to 1000 years, before they feel the need to go to Evermeet (in the Forgotten Realms) or elsewhere...

A dwarf's lifespan can be up to 500 I believe...and gnomes about 300...Halflings are on par with Humans, and Half-Elfs can stretch things out, I believe to about 200...

Either way, unless one is like a sorcerer, uses wish spells or some such nonsense, then 100 is it...

[Razorback]

Apparently I need to read up on race ages on a bit

[Bri]

Well, it isn't that big of a concern in the game, obviously (although some of the old SSI games when you casted Improved Haste on yourself...if you were human...you could age yourself until old age...)

But I think it does make a good topic of conversation...but even the elves with the lower lifespans...old age was around 500 years of age...

[dorotea]

'Ordinary' elves live as long as 600 years I think. Outstanding ones (high magi) can last 1000-2000. I think it is sort of implied that because PC is Bhaalspawn his/her longevity is not that of an ordinary human. I maybe wrong - but I think it can be at least used as an explanation. Ellesime is supposedly immortal, and she is a half-goddess too. What happens after you give up the 'essense', do you lose this 'immortality' factor? Who knows.

[Bri]

'Ordinary' elves live as long as 600 years I think. Outstanding ones (high magi) can last 1000-2000. I think it is sort of implied that because PC is Bhaalspawn his/her longevity is not that of an ordinary human. I maybe wrong - but I think it can be at least used as an explanation. Ellesime is supposedly immortal, and she is a half-goddess too. What happens after you give up the 'essense', do you lose this 'immortality' factor? Who knows.

Yeah, there are some variations within the elven race for age, but even the lowest rung variety for lifespan (the drow) still outlive humans easily enough.

Of course, it was also a given that BioWare screwed with the years as well. I mean, elves, dwarves, and gnomes live longer than humans and if one went adventuring at age 20 like it says in BG1...well, they would still be considered a young child by their respective society.

And I don't consider exceptions like Ellesime, for as you said, she is half-goddess herself and all that other stuff.

I figure that after divesting oneself of the taint, you are limited to the lifespan of your given race...you retain the abilities of your race which weren't mixed up with the taint of Bhaal.

[Lord Ernie]

Bioware screwed around quite alot with the ages, as it's mentioned at several times in the game that Imoen is about the same age as you, even if you're an Elf. And according to PnP rules, a 20-year old elf is actually still a child (mentally and physically).

As for the ages, I don't know about 2nd Edition, really. 3rd edition has a number of changes, such as Elves actually die of old age, and haste spells no longer influence your age and so on.

Anyway, in 3rd Edition it's something like this: Elves: 700+ (as in something over 700 years), Dwarves 400+, Half-Elves 180+, Gnomes 350+, Halflings 150+, Humans: 80 - 90 years, Half-Orcs: 70 years.

Anyway, I don't think there's a single Romance or even mod where this kind of thing is taken into consideration... There's only one game I've ever played where such a thing was mentioned between you and your romance interest (of which there was only one in the game, an Elf). It was called Arcanum or something in the like, I think...

[Bri]

Well, I only mentioned something about it in passing. I didn't want to spend to much time on it, since the whole of Baldur's Gate II can be assumed to take place in 1 years time...at best...

And the life span isn't too great between 2nd Edition and 3rd Edition...

As for Arcanum? My video card wasn't good enough for it Oh well.

[Lord Ernie]

Really?

I've played that game through and never even knew of the existance of any kind of romance...

There is one, in fact... at least a very small one. There's about three chats you can have, and in chats, I mean not BG2 style, but quite alot shorter... If you're interested, I believe she was called Raven or something, an Elven princess if I'm not mistaking; I discovered the romance only on my third playthrough too, play half-elf, elf or human to get it (and be nice and good-looking).

Well, I only mentioned something about it in passing. I didn't want to spend to much time on it, since the whole of Baldur's Gate II can be assumed to take place in 1 years time...at best...

And the life span isn't too great between 2nd Edition and 3rd Edition...

All too true, but I recall Tashia worries about the past quite alot, so why not about the future? Besides, it's a quite obvious thing to consider for a character even though it's not to be found (or wrong (Aerie)) in most romances...

As for Arcanum? My video card wasn't good enough for it. Oh well

What the hell? I didn't even know the game had any special video card requirements. I mean it's not 3d or something, so...

[Bri]

Yeah, but several of the dialogues do have "worry about the future" ideas included.

As for the video card, yes, it did. Mine was a weird one that came with my Compaq computer, and where the backround would be, it was either black or completely lined.

So, yeah, I know it wasn't anything fancy, it just happened to be some kind of glitch. The same reason I could play Civilization III quite well, but not Vampire the Masquerade...