83 replies to this topic

[Yuwakusha]

Hello fellow people of Spellhold Studios. I am relatively new, and I hope to get involved in some of the many activities here. However, the concept of NPC's is intriguing and I would definetely like to try my luck with creating one. I have given it a lot of thought and hope that at least *some* attributes of this character are unique.

Name: Srilorin (Full name: Srilorin'ath'Jalin Zlaorateel)
Race: Elf
Alignment: Chaotic Neutral
Class: Kensai

Stats:
Strength: 18/00
Dexterity: 14
Constitution: 12
Intelligence: 13
Wisdom: 12
Charisma: 14



Weapon Proficiencies: 4 stars in the Two-Handed Sword.
Level at meeting: 10.
Personal Items: Yes.

Special Abilities:
-Charm Person X3 per day.
-Lay on Hands or Heal spell X1 per day. (?)
-True Sight X3 per day.

Natural Resistances
-Spell Resistance +11 at level one. (gains +3 every two levels)
-Permanent protection from evil.
-Natural Resistance to Poison(?)


Romanceable: By females of all classes, all races, and all alignments.

Biography:

When asked about his past, SRILORIN merely chuckles amusedly and runs his fingers through his crimson hair. His past is mysterious, even to his comrades and when asked more specifically about the matter, he simply states that he was born in the elven city of Myth Drannor within the elven empire Comanthyr. Tall and thickly muscled, Srilorin would be undoubtedly considered handsome by many and though despite his somewhat vain attitude and confidence, he has a certain rebelliousness that outlines his otherwise good heart. And his eyes burn with quiet inquisition for his surroundings, hinting at the secrets and knowledge hidden just below their depths.

History:

Srilorin is what you would call a Celadrin or a celestial elf, or the counterpart to a fey'ri. Srilorin was born due to the union of an Firre Eladrin father from the plane of Arborea and a gold elven mother from a small gold elven village called Aluianti during the Midsummer Festival, a event held in honor of Hanali Celanil: the elven goddess of love and beauty. Even though they were in love, his father eventually had to return to Arborea. His mother departed from Aluianti and took up residence in Myth Drannor shortly before giving birth to Srilorin.

He was a child when he lost his mother due to a Red Wizard invasion and was taken away by the Red Wizards to become enslaved. After years of servitude, Srilorin was sold to the Cowled Wizards within Athkatla and was sent to enlist in the Academy of Arms in Amn to hone his skills as a fighter to become the main protecter of some of the most powerful and influential of the Cowled Wizards. As a result he is generally distrustful of Cowled Wizards as well as red Wizards of Thay, but he honestly tries not to cling to the standard prejudice and makes an honest effort to remember that everyone is different and that there are exceptions to every person.

Physical Description:

Srilorin is tall and thickly muscled with flaming red hair, deep golden eyes, and bronze skin. He is often clad in black or gray and wears a scowling or amused expression.

Personality:

Years of fighting and servitude as a slave have made Srilorin strong-willed, independent, and extremely sardonic. He has depended upon his own resources for his entire adolescence giving him a sense of pride and confidence, though not to the point of being egotistical. He is passionate and flirty in certain situations, but I promise I won't create another Coran. Underneath all of his attributes and rebelliousness however, he has a generally good heart and pure motivations, simply because he doesn't have a reason not to be.

If more details are needed let me know.

Oh and here are a couple of banters for your enjoyment.



Srilorin: Imoen? You have been eyeing me analytically for the past ten minutes. May I help you with something?

Imoen: (She grins broadly.) As a matter of fact, yes you can. If you don?t mind me saying though, you remind me a lot of Sune. Or at least you bear a very strong resemblance to her.

Srilorin: I?m a beautiful, long haired, lust driven female?

Imoen: I think I can safely assume that you and I just got the first seven words correct Srilorin.

Srilorin: (He chuckles amusedly.) Then I thank you my dear girl. If I can indeed assume that that was a compliment.

Imoen: (She grins again at him.) Anytime Srilorin. Anytime.




Srilorin: Ahhhh! Minsc!!

Minsc: What? Where is the sneaky villain that hides from Minsc and Boo?! Righteous butt-kicking shall be delivered from Minsc?s boots!! Go for the eyes Boo! GO FOR THE EYE--

Srilorin: Your *rat* has been shedding his foul hair about my pack and belongings *again*! Tell him to keep his probing whiskers out of my things, or I may have to settle for a new pair of rodent gloves.

Minsc: Well Boo? You heard the elf, no more sneaking around for you mister! Yes I know he is a bit feminine, but at least he is good with his sword.

Srilorin: You do realize that my hearing is rather extensive yes?

Minsc: What was that good Srilorin?

Srilorin: Nothing. Now let us move on while my senses remain intact.

Edited by Yuwakusha, 18 February 2009 - 06:07 PM.

[berelinde]

Man, this thread has been quiet. Might as well get things started, since there's nothing worse than posting your NPC idea and hearing crickets.

I'm raising my eyebrows a lot at what you're writing. It could be that I just don't know Srilorin, but I see a bunch of warning flags. I'm not saying this to criticize. I'm saying this because I don't want you to get discouraged by real criticism later.

We all write our NPCs to bring a character to life. Yes, we're writing characters we want to see, but the most successful NPCs have a sense of realism about them. There's a bit of fantasy wish fulfilment involved, perhaps, but the characters are more than a collection of superlatives. Kivan is an emotionally sensitive, caring, sad ranger that you want to comfort, but he's also a bit of a pain in the butt at times. With Kivan, you have to take the good with the bad. He appeals to a broad range of players because he is a complex character.

Now, take a look at NPCs that were written specifically to somebody's dream specifications. Where the player's fantasy is the same as the modder's, well, that works out well for everyone. But when the player starts thinking "Wow, Modder X really likes her men that way, doesn't she?" it kind of ruins the mood. It's kind of hard doing this without naming names, but there are NPCs I just can't play because the modder's self-insertion is just too jarring.

And sometimes, it's a lot of fun to write for a character you don't like all the time. I always liked putting my guys in uncomfortable spots and watching them squirm a bit, and letting them look like idiots, every once in a while, too.

Now on to the Srilorin specifics.

Race: Celadrin (celestial elf)

Why an elf? Why a celestial elf? Could he be an aasimar that bucked the trend toward goodness? But if he's a celestial elf, he's a celestial elf. What's going on with that bit of fey'ri later, though? Is he a tiefling, besides?

Stats:
Strength: 18/00
Dexterity: 12
Constitution: 12
Intelligence: 16
Wisdom: 10
Charisma: 18
(Let me know if you think anything here is too overpowered.)

They might be overpowered. If he's a Kensai, it won't matter all that much, since Kensai are dex fighters, but if he's a straight fighter, that can wear any armor in the game and gain 5 stars in any weapon he chooses, that maximum strength is going to be a heck of a boon. He's stronger than Minsc, and more charismatic than Keldorn. He's got two stats maxed out, for his race. That's a lot. It means that not only is he the strongest elf currently alive in the world, he is also the most charismatic. Man, that's a lot of pressure to put on one NPC. Can you write him in a way that will make those stats more than just numbers on his character screen?

Special Abilities:
-Charm Person X3 per day.
-Lay on Hands or Heal spell X1 per day. (?)
-True Sight X3 per day.

So, he's got the laying on hands of a vanilla paladin and the true sight of an Inquisitor, and the ability to charm on top of it? What disabilities are you giving him to balance this? Paladins trade off the ability to achieve grand mastery and have strict alignment restrictions. Inquisitors trade off laying on hands and spell use for their true sight.

Natural Resistances
-Spell Resistance +11 at level one. (gains +3 every two levels)

That's better than Firkraag.

-Permanent protection from evil.

He's CN. Is it important for CN characters to be protected from evil? How does that figure into his story?

-Natural Resistance to Poison(?)

You seem unsure of this, and I would be, too. Elves don't get poison resistance, as a rule. He's going to get sleep and charm protection from his elven ancestry, don't forget.

When asked about his past, SRILORIN merely chuckles amusedly and runs his fingers through his crimson hair. His past is mysterious, even to his comrades and when asked more specifically about the matter, he simply states that he was born in the elven city of Myth Drannor within the elven empire Comanthyr. Tall and thickly muscled, Srilorin would be undoubtedly considered handsome by many and though despite his somewhat vain attitude and confidence, he has a certain rebelliousness that outlines his otherwise good heart. And his eyes burn with quiet inquisition for his surroundings, hinting at the secrets and knowledge hidden just below their depths.

I was going to roll my eyes at the crimson hair, but then I remembered that the color is a legitimate choice for a star elf. So no eye-rolling over that. But the mysterious past thing... you could always say "He does not say much of his past. If asked directly, he replies that it was rather dull, and changes the subject. He mumbles something about Myth Drannor, in the elven empire of Cormanthyr."

The player will probably get to observe his vanity, confidence, and possible rebelliousness for herself, but is there anything in his outward appearance that would suggest a good heart? I don't know if you need to get much into physical description in the bio. With an 18/00 strength, the player will have a clear enough idea about his musculature. Most guys you see at the gym have strengths in the 12-16 range, and they're certainly big enough. An 18/00 would make him bigger than Aahnold. In general, you probably won't need to say much about his looks at all. The player will be looking at a portrait, don't forget.

History:

Well, can't say much, here. Adventurers do tend to have rather colorful backgrounds, unless they're Hubelpot, of course.

[Yuwakusha]

Man, this thread has been quiet. Might as well get things started, since there's nothing worse than posting your NPC idea and hearing crickets.

I'm raising my eyebrows a lot at what you're writing. It could be that I just don't know Srilorin, but I see a bunch of warning flags. I'm not saying this to criticize. I'm saying this because I don't want you to get discouraged by real criticism later.

We all write our NPCs to bring a character to life. Yes, we're writing characters we want to see, but the most successful NPCs have a sense of realism about them. There's a bit of fantasy wish fulfilment involved, perhaps, but the characters are more than a collection of superlatives. Kivan is an emotionally sensitive, caring, sad ranger that you want to comfort, but he's also a bit of a pain in the butt at times. With Kivan, you have to take the good with the bad. He appeals to a broad range of players because he is a complex character.

Now, take a look at NPCs that were written specifically to somebody's dream specifications. Where the player's fantasy is the same as the modder's, well, that works out well for everyone. But when the player starts thinking "Wow, Modder X really likes her men that way, doesn't she?" it kind of ruins the mood. It's kind of hard doing this without naming names, but there are NPCs I just can't play because the modder's self-insertion is just too jarring.

And sometimes, it's a lot of fun to write for a character you don't like all the time. I always liked putting my guys in uncomfortable spots and watching them squirm a bit, and letting them look like idiots, every once in a while, too.

Now on to the Srilorin specifics.

Race: Celadrin (celestial elf)

Why an elf? Why a celestial elf? Could he be an aasimar that bucked the trend toward goodness? But if he's a celestial elf, he's a celestial elf. What's going on with that bit of fey'ri later, though? Is he a tiefling, besides?

Stats:
Strength: 18/00
Dexterity: 12
Constitution: 12
Intelligence: 16
Wisdom: 10
Charisma: 18
(Let me know if you think anything here is too overpowered.)

They might be overpowered. If he's a Kensai, it won't matter all that much, since Kensai are dex fighters, but if he's a straight fighter, that can wear any armor in the game and gain 5 stars in any weapon he chooses, that maximum strength is going to be a heck of a boon. He's stronger than Minsc, and more charismatic than Keldorn. He's got two stats maxed out, for his race. That's a lot. It means that not only is he the strongest elf currently alive in the world, he is also the most charismatic. Man, that's a lot of pressure to put on one NPC. Can you write him in a way that will make those stats more than just numbers on his character screen?

Special Abilities:
-Charm Person X3 per day.
-Lay on Hands or Heal spell X1 per day. (?)
-True Sight X3 per day.

So, he's got the laying on hands of a vanilla paladin and the true sight of an Inquisitor, and the ability to charm on top of it? What disabilities are you giving him to balance this? Paladins trade off the ability to achieve grand mastery and have strict alignment restrictions. Inquisitors trade off laying on hands and spell use for their true sight.

Natural Resistances
-Spell Resistance +11 at level one. (gains +3 every two levels)

That's better than Firkraag.

-Permanent protection from evil.

He's CN. Is it important for CN characters to be protected from evil? How does that figure into his story?

-Natural Resistance to Poison(?)

You seem unsure of this, and I would be, too. Elves don't get poison resistance, as a rule. He's going to get sleep and charm protection from his elven ancestry, don't forget.

When asked about his past, SRILORIN merely chuckles amusedly and runs his fingers through his crimson hair. His past is mysterious, even to his comrades and when asked more specifically about the matter, he simply states that he was born in the elven city of Myth Drannor within the elven empire Comanthyr. Tall and thickly muscled, Srilorin would be undoubtedly considered handsome by many and though despite his somewhat vain attitude and confidence, he has a certain rebelliousness that outlines his otherwise good heart. And his eyes burn with quiet inquisition for his surroundings, hinting at the secrets and knowledge hidden just below their depths.

I was going to roll my eyes at the crimson hair, but then I remembered that the color is a legitimate choice for a star elf. So no eye-rolling over that. But the mysterious past thing... you could always say "He does not say much of his past. If asked directly, he replies that it was rather dull, and changes the subject. He mumbles something about Myth Drannor, in the elven empire of Cormanthyr."

The player will probably get to observe his vanity, confidence, and possible rebelliousness for herself, but is there anything in his outward appearance that would suggest a good heart? I don't know if you need to get much into physical description in the bio. With an 18/00 strength, the player will have a clear enough idea about his musculature. Most guys you see at the gym have strengths in the 12-16 range, and they're certainly big enough. An 18/00 would make him bigger than Aahnold. In general, you probably won't need to say much about his looks at all. The player will be looking at a portrait, don't forget.

History:

Well, can't say much, here. Adventurers do tend to have rather colorful backgrounds, unless they're Hubelpot, of course.

I had thought 18/00 was lower than Minsc's stat of 18/93. But I will definetely lower it to a more practical number.

Now I'm thinking something instead like:

Strength: 18/85
Dexterity: 12
Constitution:10
Intelligence: 15
Wisdom:10
Charisma: 15

I was especially unsure about special abilities since he IS part celestial and that they have abilities like Protection from Evil, Spell Resistance, Poison Immunity etc, but I think due to a partly elven and celestial heritage he should get something no? And working for Cowled Wizards and Red Wizards for all those years makes me think that he should ONLY have the natural ability of Spell Resistance. (Or he doesn't have to have it at all.)

Natural Ability:
Spell Resistance-5 at creation level plus 1 every three levels (?)

And you mentioned that it is good idea to substitute qualities for everyone's tastes and expectations, and I think that all NPC's should have some sort or a few flaws to point out that he/she is not perfect, so vanity and a bit of over-confidence would definetely be like Srilorin. On the other hand he would be loyal and honest which I think are qualities that should be admirable by everyone.

His red hair was laughable, my best friend would tease me about it as I was making this character, but after all he does worship Hanali Cenalil.

And thanks a bunch for the suggestions.

[Tempest]

I second most of Berelinde's criticism, but I also have a couple points:

Underneath all of his attributes and rebelliousness however, he has a generally good heart and pure motivations, simply because he doesn't have a reason not to be.

This, with a CN alignment? [Most] CN characters don't care about good or evil, and don't have pure motivations-they're generally out for more mundane or abstract things than selflessness, the good of all people, etc.

Ability-wise, I'll say this flatly: Srilorin is hideously overpowered. Kensai are a brutal enough class as it is, and any one of his true sight/protection from evil/heal/spell resistance (heck, any third of his true sight/spell resistance) puts him over the top.

I'd also recommend you take a deep breath and read up on your FR lore-Celadrins do not exist anywhere but in 4E (which I personally maintain does not exist), and BG2 is a mishmash between 2E and 3E. Eladrins are the CG equivalent of Archons, and are angels for all intents and purposes. Half-Celestials have a +4 LA in PnP, so unless you intend to come up with a way for him to constantly lag 4 levels behind the rest of the party, I suggest you don't try to replicate a Half-Celestial's benefits.

If you want to maintain the celestial elf theme, you could borrow a page from Saerileth's book and have him be from the plane of Arborea, but he'd only be an ordinary elf-just one who hails from a plane of absolute goodness.

I can't comment much on his backstory, but I highly recommend you put him through the Mary Sue Litmus Test. It sounds like you're very enthusiastic about your idea, which is always good, but it sounds like you may be wanting to make another Tsujatha or Kelsey. Just take some time to think about this character-what is part of his storyline and makes sense, and what is just gratuitous?

[berelinde]

I'll say this for you, Yuwakusha, you are certainly on the right track with his stats, and you seem to have a very positive attitude. That's important. And thank you for taking my comments in the spirit they were intended.

The stats are much better the second time around. He's still powerful, but he is considerably better balanced. Stats aren't everything, but you're getting there. As you think about the idea further, you might come up with a clearer idea of where you want to go with his unique race/class.

Am I reading correctly that you're discarding all special abilities besides a reduced magic resistance? Good, better balance that way.

So keep fine-tuning, keep refining your ideas, and you'll do fine. Hopefully, some more people will weigh in with suggestions.

[Yuwakusha]

I'll say this for you, Yuwakusha, you are certainly on the right track with his stats, and you seem to have a very positive attitude. That's important. And thank you for taking my comments in the spirit they were intended.

The stats are much better the second time around. He's still powerful, but he is considerably better balanced. Stats aren't everything, but you're getting there. As you think about the idea further, you might come up with a clearer idea of where you want to go with his unique race/class.

Am I reading correctly that you're discarding all special abilities besides a reduced magic resistance? Good, better balance that way.

So keep fine-tuning, keep refining your ideas, and you'll do fine. Hopefully, some more people will weigh in with suggestions.

This is my first attempt at something like this, and I truly appreciate any comments and criticism.
I'll continue refining and writing and hopefully I won't create another Tsujatha or Kelsey. (even though love them both.)

[Yuwakusha]

Oh and Tempest?

0-16 Points
Most likely Not-Sue. Characters at this level could probably take a little spicing up without hurting them any.

17-21
Probably not a Mary-Sue, although a character can go either way at this point. Fanfiction writers should pay attention to ensure that their characters aren't getting too Sue-ish. For an RPG or original fiction character, however, you're probably perfectly fine.

22-29
Some definite Sue-like tendancies here. A little polishing might be in order to put original fiction and RPG characters back into the balance, especially if Kirking is involved. Fanfiction characters should probably have some work done.

30+
Fanfiction authors beware - Mary's on the loose. There's still a chance you can save this character with some TLC, though. Role-players and original fiction characters, you should also strongly consider giving your character a workover.

36+
Fanfiction authors, you might just want to start over. Role-players and original fiction authors, at this point your characters are likely to provoke eye-rolling and exclaimations of "yeah, right!" from your readers. (Well, at least from me.) Immediate workover is probably in order.

50+
Kill it dead. Or make sure you read the instructions properly (some people don't do this, which causes freakishly high scores) and take the test again.


Your score is 25.

Looks like some definite repolishing is in order.

[vilkacis]

*mod note* Play nice now, and try to stick to the topic at hand. If you want to discuss Tempest's writing, do it in his comment thread or via PM. */mod note*


2E doesn't use the concept of "level adjustment"; rather, more powerful races tend to have a penalty to XP gained, typically from 10-20%. I think it's possible to implement this in BG2 - if you want to keep some special abilities, you could also try to offset them this way.

I like the second stat set, it feels pretty balanced.

[edit] I keep reading his name as "Sirloin", though, which feels rather odd.

Edited by vilkacis, 01 September 2008 - 02:28 AM.

[Paareth]

Here?s my take, forgive me though its been awhile since I modded .

With him being of an elven nature, I?d lower the strength still further and raise the dex slightly in its place. This is of course counterproductive in game mechanic terms but helpful in terms of realism

Especially given that this:

-Spell Resistance +11 at level one. (gains +3 every two levels)

Is extremely powerful

Perhaps you can have a quest which the player has to work for to unlock the ?full? character, I?d certainly appreciate that more than being given someone who was very strong from the start, as I wouldn?t feel I?d been given him for free

Your writing is of a very high standard and I am sure the NPC will be enjoyable to play whatever route you take, best of luck.

I can't comment much on his backstory, but I highly recommend you put him through the Mary Sue Litmus Test. It sounds like you're very enthusiastic about your idea, which is always good, but it sounds like you may be wanting to make another Tsujatha or Kelsey. Just take some time to think about this character-what is part of his storyline and makes sense, and what is just gratuitous?

Though its useful in a way and would be a great test for a fiction writer, unless the average Baldurs gate Party NPC was a human commoner it doesn't really apply to our NPC's in its current form quite as well. I had actually considered coding a commoner at one point but even then he's going to have to be exceptional with a sword or his reflexes, something to make him both worth having in your party and more importantly to have him survive what he'll face. I wouldn?t make that choice to create a heroic fictional character, just a normal party NPC, so the base level to gauge our creations is somewhat different.

Then you have the fact that NPC's are often of a different race than human, which in Faerun or more importantly Baldurs Gate 2, okay a Drow would apply to being special but an elf or half elf are quite normal. A half elf will score even more hits on that test for instance and thus it seems we need to modify the results accordingly.

I?d say take a third off at least in terms of relevance or try to judge whats normal for Faerun before you make too many changes to your build.

However the test did make me reconsider a few aspects of one of my latest NPC?s in the pack I am coding, I?ll probably knock her stats down slightly as a result.

Edited by Paareth, 01 September 2008 - 01:19 PM.

[Yuwakusha]

Here?s my take, forgive me though its been awhile since I modded .

With him being of an elven nature, I?d lower the strength still further and raise the dex slightly in its place. This is of course counterproductive in game mechanic terms but helpful in terms of realism

Especially given that this:

-Spell Resistance +11 at level one. (gains +3 every two levels)

Is extremely powerful

Perhaps you can have a quest which the player has to work for to unlock the ?full? character, I?d certainly appreciate that more than being given someone who was very strong from the start, as I wouldn?t feel I?d been given him for free

Your writing is of a very high standard and I am sure the NPC will be enjoyable to play whatever route you take, best of luck.

I can't comment much on his backstory, but I highly recommend you put him through the Mary Sue Litmus Test. It sounds like you're very enthusiastic about your idea, which is always good, but it sounds like you may be wanting to make another Tsujatha or Kelsey. Just take some time to think about this character-what is part of his storyline and makes sense, and what is just gratuitous?

Though its useful in a way and would be a great test for a fiction writer, unless the average Baldurs gate Party NPC was a human commoner it doesn't really apply to our NPC's in its current form quite as well. I had actually considered coding a commoner at one point but even then he's going to have to be exceptional with a sword or his reflexes, something to make him both worth having in your party and more importantly to have him survive what he'll face. I wouldn?t make that choice to create a heroic fictional character, just a normal party NPC, so the base level to gauge our creations is somewhat different.

Then you have the fact that NPC's are often of a different race than human, which in Faerun or more importantly Baldurs Gate 2, okay a Drow would apply to being special but an elf or half elf are quite normal. A half elf will score even more hits on that test for instance and thus it seems we need to modify the results accordingly.

I?d say take a third off at least in terms of relevance or try to judge whats normal for Faerun before you make too many changes to your build.

However the test did make me reconsider a few aspects of one of my latest NPC?s in the pack I am coding, I?ll probably knock her stats down slightly as a result.

The only reason I would try and create something that was not "ordinary" to Faerun is because I want this specific NPC for example stand out as far as background goes, and I thought that an ordinary elf would be too basic. I think now, I just have to construct his background perhaps in a bit more of a unique way so he stands out while he is something that is not completely out of place.

His spell resistance was completely laughable as being the dummy I am had no idea how powerful that was.
And thank you everybody for your suggestions etc. I really do appreciate them.

And vilkacis?
Srilorin or Sirloin?

That had me going for a while, and would you believe I came up with Szordrin, but that is already the name of a drow in Ust Natha?

[minotaur_in_maze]

And you mentioned that it is good idea to substitute qualities for everyone's tastes and expectations, and I think that all NPC's should have some sort or a few flaws to point out that he/she is not perfect, so vanity and a bit of over-confidence would definetely be like Srilorin. On the other hand he would be loyal and honest which I think are qualities that should be admirable by everyone.

I feel that you are reaching here, and assuming a lot. Fact of the matter is, there are a lot of different types of NPCs in game and lots of different options for the player - and if you are going to play "In Character", making your NPC seem real in relation to the others in the group then loyalty and honesty are Not qualities that EVERYONE would find admirable.

I'm sorry but I see probs with Korgan, Viconia and maybe even Haer Dalis. Are you trying to make this person not only extremely powerful, but loved by all? Life don't work that way.

As for the power/overpower thing, second revision much better - but if the character IS overpowered and you want/need to Keep him that way then give him some major personality flaws/issues to balance that out.

MiM - Modding Muse / Writer/Concept Creator OCTOBER NPC - In Progress.

[Azkyroth]

Not to mention "loyal" and "honest" aren't exactly what comes to mind when most people think of Chaotic Neutral. That's going to raise a lot of eyebrows (as, honestly, is the attempt to give him a "unique" impressive background).

[Tempest]

Loyalty is also frankly paradoxical in a CN character-one of the more common descriptions of a chaotic alignment in DnD is one of loyalty only to one's own principles-loyalty as a quality itself has little to no meaning to a chaotic character.

[berelinde]

Alternately, a CN character may value individual freedom more than society's laws. A character who says "To the nine hells with the rest of you, me and my team are getting out of this alive!" might well be CN, yet still be loyal to the rest of the team.

[Yuwakusha]

I am so changing his name already so he doesn't resemble a porterhouse steak.

The stats I had before were laughable and as Tempest clearly and truly stated "hideously over-powered." Unfortunately, I had no idea how powerful an 18/00 strength was. See what happens when you don't pay attention?


And as far as loyalty and honesty go, Berelinde has it right.

When I desribe loyalty as a positive attribute, he definetely won't be like Keldorn or a LG Anomen, but loyal in the sense that he won't betray the group outright and sell <CHARNAME> over at the nearest opportunity. And as far as charismatic and likeness from the rest of the group goes, he will actually dislike or even show outright contempt for a few select Bioware NPCs and vice versa.
And I can honestly say I see no problems with honesty as a upside or positive trait. A person may be frank and direct in the way that they handle their affairs, but it doesn't mean they must be LG to practice it. Eh, just my opinion on the matter anyway.

And thanks for the continued criticism.

Edited by Yuwakusha, 02 October 2008 - 11:45 PM.

[Bardess]

Hey, beginners make mistakes. I'm still ashamed of my own. x.x
Good luck with your NPC!

[Yuwakusha]

Thanks a bunch Bardess.
By the way, I though you should know how much I adore Moddie.

[Deva]

Hello.

I just wanted to say that it's great to see someone responding so pro actively and positively to comments being made. There are a fair few (including myself, some of the time,) who wouldn't take criticism, however well-meant, so gracefully.

I also wanted to say that the character sounds interesting, and I love the name. 'Srilorin' has a lovely ring to it, very elven.

One problem I have is with his race - celestial elves. I'm skeptical about anyone proposing a celestial anything. I think it can be a bit of an easy 'selling point', if you get me. If his story and writing is unique enough, I don't think you should need celestial heritage to single him out as special. On the other hand, if it's done well enough, there's no reason he shouldn't be a celestial elf. So I suppose what I'm saying, is think about it.

Anyway. Good luck, pet!

[Yuwakusha]

Thank you very much Deva, I appreciate you criticism.
After Tempest told me about the four level experience lag with celestials/demons and the downsides, I decided that it would be best to just make him a standard elf since he would have to constantly be four levels behind the rest of the party and I'd have to balance out all those crazy,overpowering abilities. Eh, would probably just give me a headache.



And best wishes with Ninde dear!