52 replies to this topic

[Laufey]

As for 'likely impact of my story on the gameworld' - chuckle again. You are making me puff up like a puffer fish. I seriously doubt this mod will have much impact on ToB rating. ROFLMAO!

LOL! Go on, Dorotea, puff away! The worst thing that could happen is that there will be flying bits of Beholder all over the place.

[dorotea]

Rabid petitioners for a Gorch Romance mod notwithstanding.

Who the heck is Gorch? /flaps the lashes on all of her many eyes/

Chuckle. It was a fine joke, right?

[dorotea]

LOL! Go on, Dorotea, puff away! The worst thing that could happen is that there will be flying bits of Beholder all over the place.

And this will be a terrible mess that the board coordinators would not like.

[Hendryk]

As is, the only NPC's who wouldn't want him instantly dead would be Sarevok (who missed SoA) and, maybe, Haer'Dalis if allying with Jon struck his poetic sensibility the right way.

So, why not rule that his death in hell terminated the curse of the Seldarine and bring him back as the elf he was just before the sentence was carried out? This would dilute the impact of having him around (no cool S&M avatar) but would also give the other NPCs a reason to have second thoughts. It would also make a return to Suldanesselar potentially much more interesting.

[Userunfriendly]

So don't play it then. It's that simple.

Thank you for reminding me of my options.

but I don't see why you guys need to discourage the writer of the mod if you find the very idea of it unappealing or implausible.

Perhaps you're accustomed to an environment where the only approved reaction to a creative project is "More please!" written twenty times, but I like to think I have slightly more latitude to express my opinion. And my opinion is that I think Domi makes an excellent point about the plausibility of having the majority of the 15 surviving SOA NPCs available to travel with Jonbon. And I've expressed it.

I support Dorotea's efforts to create a mod to tell her story. I reserve my right to express my opinion about the likely impact of her story on the gameworld and the validity of the resulting characterization, however. And Dorotea's within her right to say "Just wait and see" and I'm within my rights to say "I'm still skeptical."

You may choose to counteract me by saying "More please!", or not, as you wish.

More please!!!

i personally will admit to being very interested in edwin after reading laufey's excellent stories, and while i have tried to read "story of a girl without a name", its not a story that engrossed me like "in the cards" or "cards reshuffled"...having said that, all the stuff i have read in this forum makes me very very very interested in the mod, if only to see how dorotea will make the mod logically internally consistant within the framework of the game, or even throw that framework away....in either case, what i will be looking for is creativity and artistic expression....and i am prepared to judge the mod on that basis alone...

even if dorotea chooses to completely disregard the framework of the game or even the forgotten wars "universe", i am very interested in how she will structure the mod, and i am prepared to judge the mod on its own merits alone...and i suspect most people who are in this forum are anticipating a very creative work, with many many interesting plot complications and lots of facinating dialog...

which is why we spend many hours late at night downloading these huge files over a stinking 56k phone line...

and quite frankly, people, mod makers make mods because of the characters and situations and plots THEY love are not already written in to the game...and its pretty obvious that dorotea loves the concept of redemption and jon and she likes her own creative vision of jon enough to spend the time and energy to make her own visions come to life, and if you happen to like that vision, fine, but if you dont like it, thats fine too...dorotea is doing work to make her visions a reality, and we have to respect that her visions may not conform to your own special visions of what you would like to see in a mod...in the end, a mod maker has to remain true to herself, and to her own creative imagination...this aint no democrasy, folks....

she is sticking to her guns, and doing the mod her way, and all we can ever do in support is simply read what she wants to share, and make constructive comments...and to be supportive, since a creative muse can often be a burden( and a joy)....

i personally am very very much looking forward to the mod, and lets be honest here, after i download it, and install it, and even browse thru it using idu, i might decide to uninstall it, and delete the zip file, because i dont like it, but thats my decision....

until then i will keep saying...

MORE PLEASE!!!!

[Slumlord]

Gorch is the storekeeper who runs the front operation at MaeVar's. One of my colleagues believes he would make the dreamiest romance ever.

Well now there's a fresh new look on a character that I've always thought of as "The storekeep - he's dead."

The way I see it is that Jon Bon could now be a new character for a video game so that will garnish some interest in me to play the game again at some point. Then again I'll probably just kill him since I get tired of watching this guy return from the dead... again.

The conflits will be very strong with the majority of the NPCs as Irenicus is what he is - the force of evil and stepped by his actions on almost everyone's most sensitive spot.

So?

[dorotea]

i personally will admit to being very interested in edwin after reading laufey's excellent stories, and while i have tried to read "story of a girl without a name", its not a story that engrossed me like "in the cards" or "cards reshuffled"...having said that, all the stuff i have read in this forum makes me very very very interested in the mod

Personally I think the 'Story of a Girl without a Name' is somewhat amateurish , maybe until the Chapter Six or so, but you have to survive the first five chapters to get to the interesting stuff ... I always wanted to re-write it. Oh well... later perhaps.

If you want to read something I really like myself - try 'Bitter Grey Ashes'.

http://www.onlinefic...itterAshes.html

And don't worry - I really am flattered by all the fuss, and think that everybody has a right for free speech on this board. If people find it entertaining to discuss my ideas - I only feel better for providing them with a food for thought.

[dorotea]

The way I see is that Jon Bon could now be a new character for a video game so that will garnish some interest in me to play the game again at some point. Then again I'll probably just kill him since I get tired of watching this guy return from the dead... again.

Chuckle. Hopefully I can provide you with some entertainment as well. That is exactly the type of mind I am styling my 'evil path' for.

[jurts]

One silly thing caught in my mind - remember how you lose 2 rep points when Vicky joins the party? How many points will you lose by taking Jonny in the party? 22?

Uhhhh, I can see why the NPC's reaction might be problematic, especially M/I/J...

Ok, Minsc has taken enough blows to the head through SoA to make him forget who Dynaheir was... and Immy who stays with an evil party until the rep drops to 2 points - you can chop children to pieces in city streets and she dost not protest about it, so strong is her bond to the PC... not sure about J though. If she's being romanced - yes, perhaps - otherwise, unsure... she's too stubborn and full of rage and hate to get over that. Hey, I would support the requirement that Jaheira needs to be romanced to make her accept Jonny in the party, that would sit well with me!

[Laufey]

Ok, Minsc has taken enough blows to the head through SoA to make him forget who Dynaheir was... and Immy who stays with an evil party until the rep drops to 2 points - you can chop children to pieces in city streets and she dost not protest about it, so strong is her bond to the PC... not sure about J though. If she's being romanced - yes, perhaps - otherwise, unsure... she's too stubborn and full of rage and hate to get over that. Hey, I would support the requirement that Jaheira needs to be romanced to make her accept Jonny in the party, that would sit well with me!

However, Jaheira is also capable of having *very* strong ties to a female PC. Remember, she sacrifices her ties to the Harpers for the sake of protecting the female PC as well as the male one. I do agree that it would take a lot to convince her to accept Irenicus, but if it is to be, I don't think the 'final' argument should be a romance related one.

[jurts]

I do agree that it would take a lot to convince her to accept Irenicus, but if it is to be, I don't think the 'final' argument should be a romance related one.

No, of course not, it was intended as half-a-joke... such requirement would most likely repulse some people from this mod.

I don't see Jaheira as uncapable of compassion or forgiveness, but this is Irenicus we are talking about, though... I'm really curious about how Dorotea will work this out - if in the end I have to choose between Jaheira and Jonny, then Jon has no chance...

[Laufey]

I do agree that it would take a lot to convince her to accept Irenicus, but if it is to be, I don't think the 'final' argument should be a romance related one.

No, of course not, it was intended as half-a-joke... such requirement would most likely repulse some people from this mod.

I don't see Jaheira as uncapable of compassion or forgiveness, but this is Irenicus we are talking about, though... I'm really curious about how Dorotea will work this out - if in the end I have to choose between Jaheira and Jonny, then Jon has no chance...

Ah, I see! Sorry for being thick and not catching the joke, LOL! I agree that Jaheira is the NPC I see as being the most difficult one to reconcile with Irenicus, even more so than Minsc, I'll certainly be very interested in seeing what Dorotea is planning in to do about that.

[dorotea]

I'll certainly be very interested in seeing what Dorotea is planning in to do about that.

I don't see Jaheira as uncapable of compassion or forgiveness, but this is Irenicus we are talking about, though... I'm really curious about how Dorotea will work this out - if in the end I have to choose between Jaheira and Jonny, then Jon has no chance...

Since Jaheira is one of my personal favorites ( I feel a certain affinity to her ok? She is the closest to my heart among the female npcs) I cannot possibly make you drop her for Jon and I think I can make a convincing case for her in the 'good' path.

If you've played Redemption with Jaheira you would have noticed her reaction at the final scene. "It feels better this way"

Well, that is what I will try to play on in the Longer Road. As per SoA ending Jonny is stewing in Hell (Abyss) without slightest feeling of remorse or understanding why did he end up there (the part responsible for remorse and regret is gone - remember?) As per Planescape settings the petitioner of the Abyssal plane strong and cunning enough to adapt eventually turn into demons themselves, growing in power and strength over time. Do you think Jae would be particularly happy when she learns of this perspective for Jon Bon? What kind of punishment and retribution is this?

The problem is - the evil path. Here I am afraid the PC would either have to use his charisma and romance link or simply order her to stay and threaten concequences ( like turning to the Dark side here and now).

[Laufey]

I'll certainly be very interested in seeing what Dorotea is planning in to do about that.

I don't see Jaheira as uncapable of compassion or forgiveness, but this is Irenicus we are talking about, though... I'm really curious about how Dorotea will work this out - if in the end I have to choose between Jaheira and Jonny, then Jon has no chance...

Since Jaheira is one of my personal favorites ( I feel a certain affinity to her ok? She is the closest to my heart among the female npcs) I cannot possibly make you drop her for Jon and I think I can make a convincing case for her in the 'good' path.

If you've played Redemption with Jaheira you would have noticed her reaction at the final scene. "It feels better this way"

Well, that is what I will try to play on in the Longer Road. As per SoA ending Jonny is stewing in Hell (Abyss) without slightest feeling of remorse or understanding why did he end up there (the part responsible for remorse and regret is gone - remember?) As per Planescape settings the petitioner of the Abyssal plane strong and cunning enough to adapt eventually turn into demons themselves, growing in power and strength over time. Do you think Jae would be particularly happy when she learns of this perspective for Jon Bon? What kind of punishment and retribution is this?

The problem is - the evil path. Here I am afraid the PC would either have to use his charisma and romance link or simply order her to stay and threaten concequences ( like turning to the Dark side here and now).

Good point about how Jaheira would want a more befitting punishment, one that actually means something and will give Khalid's death the importance it deserves. I definitely agree with that. However, that she thinks this will not necessarily mean she'll welcome Jon into the party at the start of ToB I think, unless it can be made clear that this is required for that superior punishment to come about. Perhaps the Solar could explain a thing or two? Then I could see Jaheira making the sacrifice of sharing parties with Irenicus.

[dorotea]

Good point about how Jaheira would want a more befitting punishment, one that actually means something and will give Khalid's death the importance it deserves. I definitely agree with that. However, that she thinks this will not necessarily mean she'll welcome Jon into the party at the start of ToB I think, unless it can be made clear that this is required for that superior punishment to come about. Perhaps the Solar could explain a thing or two? Then I could see Jaheira making the sacrifice of sharing parties with Irenicus.

Oh, I am definitely going to make sure Jae 'knows' everything before she makes her decision to stay with the party. And Lauf - thank you for the support, it means a lot to me. I really mean it.

[Slumlord]

The problem is - the evil path. Here I am afraid the PC would either have to use his charisma and romance link or simply order her to stay and threaten concequences ( like turning to the Dark side here and now).

What problem? If Jaheira don't like it then she can hit the high road. If I want a powerful wizard in my party then I won't stand for a bunch of whiny complaints. If she gets snippy about it and won't leave then I'll kill her. If she wants to stay, fine. But it's by her own decision to stay and I'm not going to have my character lie or try using romantic tactics just to keep an expendable party member.

Then when I reach the Thone and Jon Bon tries to ask for some sort of redemption... forget it. He tried to kill me so he's a dead man... again. I hold grudges.

[dorotea]

Then when I reach the Thone and Jon Bon tries to ask for some sort of redemption... forget it. He tried to kill me so he's a dead man... again. I hold grudges.

I love your attitude! /Mad grin/ I simply love it! You are an ideal player for my evil path. Thank you for posting this.