18 replies to this topic

[Duality]

I am messing around with perhaps adding a Zhentarim incursion into Athkatla (don't ask), but I decided to do a little research before I added it.
Whoops! Major plot problem apparently/possiblely.

First of all, I'd just like to say that there is way to much freakin information online about FR. Finding one piece of info is a nightmare.

I've been using this for background:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Faerûn
http://en.wikipedia....9;s_Gate_series

And for a timeline, I've been using:
"A Grand History of the Realms" (Nightmare posted it) and
http://www.geocities...realmstime0.htm
I found both under the pinned Forgotten Realms timeline topic here.

According to wikipedia and a number of sources that I linked to from this forum, Khelben Blackstaff made an agreement with Fzoul Chembryl the same year that BGII takes place (1369 DR. At least I think it is 1369 DR), to keep the Zhentarim from expanding to.... Well, I don't know to where really. I saw somewhere that is was to keep the Zhents from expanding "east of the Thunder Peaks" and somewhere else I saw simply east for 10,000 days. Whatever that means.

I know very little about FR lore, or geography, (hey, I suck at RL geography, you can't expect me to keep track of FR geography as well) and I can't find the thunder peaks on any maps that were listed, well, I found it on one, but I can't find anything else familiar on the same map. Now I'm confused.

Sooo..... Would a Zhentarim incursion into Athkatla be breaking the agreement? Is Athkatla east of the thunder peaks? And this is prior to the "Manshoon wars", so I couldn't have a rogue clone of Manshoon running around.... Could I? That was 1370 DR right? (God this is all so confusing)

If it would constitute a breaking of the agreement, can someone suggest another semi-powerful group that might want to upset the balance of power in Athkatla. I considered the Cult of the Dragon, but I don't know enough about FR lore to know whether or not they are active in Amn or are powerful enough there to summon any kind of presence.
Plus, they seem nuts and using them might mean that I would have to get some sort of Dracolich graphic. Bleh.

Help please.

-Duality


EDIT: I just realized I'm not sure it matters. One of the posts mentioned something about the state of magic being connected to Mystra's state. If she has problems so does it. So what's one more glaring inconsistancy?

Edited by Duality, 08 July 2006 - 02:48 PM.

[Azkyroth]

If it would constitute a breaking of the agreement, can someone suggest another semi-powerful group that might want to upset the balance of power in Athkatla. I considered the Cult of the Dragon, but I don't know enough about FR lore to know whether or not they are active in Amn or are powerful enough there to summon any kind of presence.
Plus, they seem nuts and using them might mean that I would have to get some sort of Dracolich graphic. Bleh.

I can suggest one, but it depends on what precisely you want to do with it.

[EDIT]And wheTHER (bleh) canonicality is important.

Edited by Azkyroth, 08 July 2006 - 03:24 PM.

[Duality]

I can suggest one, but it depends on what precisely you want to do with it.

[EDIT]And wheTHER (bleh) canonicality is important.

I take it by your offering to suggest a group, that an action in Athkatla would indeed break the pact made by Khelben and Fzoul?

I don't think canonicality is a word. (Actually, I don't even know what you are trying to say in that phrase)

As for the group, well.......
A sketch of the plot would be:
A member of the council of six is killed, a new, charismatic but relatively unknown member is chosen. (Speaking of... how are members of the council chosen? Aren't their identities supposed to be secret? Do the other members chose a replacement?)

The new member turns out to be allied with X group. The cowled wizards find out, but the member has popular support and is plotting something heinous blah blah blah.

They set up a fairly extensive base in Athkatla. You get to stop them. Blah blah. (Ok, so that wasn't really a sketch, but does that give you a little better idea as to what the group has to be capable of?)

-Duality

[oralpain]

Is Athkatla east of the thunder peaks?

Athkatla is on the western edge of the continent, so no. The thunder peaks are about 1,000 miles NE of Athkatla, and thus far west of Zhent territory.

Here is a link to a 4410x2788, 4MB, jpeg image of Faerun. It shows most everything from Evermeet to the start of the hordelands.

http://home.rocheste...aerun_atlas.jpg

I considered the Cult of the Dragon

Though, to the best of my knowledge, no branches are specifically listed as having much to do with Athkatla, The Cult of The Dragon has cells all over the place. Some are weak, some are exceedingly powerful. it's not a stretch to stick one, with the needed power/resources, most anywhere you need to.

You should also note that only the most powerful of the cells will have dracoliches. The vast majority do not have the resources to convince (bribe, or force, generally) a dragon to accept the procedure, let alone the magic to complete the transformation. A cell attempting to gain the capital (where better than the city of coin?), knowledge, or illicit materials needed to create a dracolich could be a campaign unto itself.

Also, the Zhentarim and the Cult of the Dragon are bitter foes.

[Andyr]

Plus, the Zhents nearest to Amn are Cyricists (as opposed to worshippers of Bane), so might be less likely to hold to any agreement Fzoul's made.

[NiGHTMARE]

The Cult of the Dragon does have at least one active member in Athkatla, a guy called Vynmarius. He also works for the Council of Six, so this could lead to some interesting conflicts of interest . I'm putting him to good use of the Lands of Intrigue project.


Incidentally, the Lands of Intrigue sourcebook (for which the project is named ) states that the Twisted Rune would actively try to control or eradicate the Cult of the Dragon or the Zhentarim if they tried to expand into Amn. Same goes for the Red Wizards of Thay.

Edited by NiGHTMARE, 21 August 2006 - 02:20 PM.

[Rabain]

Why not used the Twisted Rune then? Incorporate that encounter in the Bridge district (?) into your designs.

[Bane]

Incidentally, the Lands of Intrigue sourcebook (for which the project is named wink.gif) states that the Twisted Rune would actively try to control or eradicate the Cult of the Dragon or the Zhentarim if they tried to expand into Amn. Same goes for the Red Wizards of Thay.

As usual these organisations will try their best to exterminate any interlopers on their territories but alas there's always a few who slip past .

Since the Western Zhentarim high command are mainly cyricists we will have to see how the Zhentarim fare with the resurgence of Bane's church in Amn, although Amn has a very powerful church of Cyric there (three big ex-Bane temples under their command) the infighting has weakened it already. Only time will tell.

[NiGHTMARE]

Actually, the Cyricist situation in Amn has been drastically changed by recent (1373-1374 DR) sourcebooks and novels:

The western Tower of the Eternal Eclipse was attacked by an unlikely alliance of Cyricists from the Dark Redoubt, Selunites from Hycont Abbey in Esmeltaran, and Loviatans from the Black Spires of the Maiden. Upon its fall, the Dark Redoubt claimed the tower as their own, as per a prior agreement with their temporary allies.

The Dark Redoubt was destroyed by forces from the eastern Tower in retaliation.

The eastern Tower was heavily damaged by a blue dragon called Iryklathagra, also known as "Sharpfangs".

The western Tower was "abducted" by a being called the Sojourner.

The two sides in the Sythillisian war (each allied with a different Cyricist sect) have formed a temporary truce to deal with a new, common threat in the form of strange creatures called Stingers.

Edited by NiGHTMARE, 29 August 2006 - 02:42 PM.

[Bane]

Yeah I read that in Power of Faerun lol but I don't consider that a major blow to the Cyricists to be honest since I've always thought the Mountain of Skulls temple to be their main church. Also these things hardly affected worshippers directly and the numbers of Cyricists belonging to Twin Towers wasn't very high. Can you tell me where you found out the info on the Sojourner since I don't believe I've read the right book for that. thanks

[NiGHTMARE]

The Sojourner's abduction of one of the towers is actually in a novel, rather than a sourcebook - Midnight's Mask (book 3 of the Erevis Cale trilogy), by Paul Kemp.

The abducted tower is apparently going to play a role in Kemp's upcoming new trilogy, the Twilight War, which is a "Realms shaking event". These three novels are said to focus on an epic conflict between the church of Mask and followers of Shar (specifically the Shadovar), with worshippers of Cyric (possibly the Zhentarim) being involved for good measure.

Edited by NiGHTMARE, 30 August 2006 - 01:05 AM.

[Bane]

Awesome thanks for the info, hopefully some info on the Banite Zhentarim or Banites in general lol. When are they coming out? The new trilogy that is, thanks

[NiGHTMARE]

The first novel, Shadowbred, is due out in November. However, book two isn't due out until next August, and book three not until mid-2008.

I'd use the time to read Paul S. Kemp's previous FR novels - Shadow's Witness, Twilight Falling, Dawn of Night, and Midnight's Mask (in that order). Erevis Cale makes an excellent contrast to "goody two-shoes" characters such as Drizzt, Elminster and Arilyn Moonblade.

[Andyr]

I think Cale's a pretty well-written character, yeah, although I've only read the introductory Sembian novels.

[Bane]

Is Cale an evil bloke? I got the impression he was more neutral. Would be good to read a novel about a baddy, they all seem to be neutral or good and it gets really really old after a while.

Some bozo knows nothing about anything, few years later he/she is strong enough to slay mighty beasts and gets the attention of the deities themselves.

Edited by Bane, 06 September 2006 - 01:45 PM.

[Andyr]

I am not sure of his alignment; I don't think he has been officially statted. I'd personally describe him as LE or NE with Neutral tendencies, based on his behaviour in the books I've read. He's ruthless, but not actively evil or malicious. Mask is NE so LE, NE or TN (or CE, although I don't think that fit) would be most appropriate for someone who venerates him.

[NiGHTMARE]

There are no "official" stats, but there are some stats written by Paul Kemp (the fellow who created Cale and wrote the novels), which is good enough for me . According to these, he's true neutral.

Before I post the link to the stats, note that they reflect Cale at the end of Midnight's Mask, and therefore contain spoilers for pretty much every Cale novel there is. Anywhere, here it is:

http://paulskemp.liv....com/63423.html


Incidentally, having now read through the newish sourcebook Dragons of Faerun, I can now provide an updated version of the Twin Towers of the Eternal Eclipse-related events:

Sometime in early to mid 1373 DR, the eastern tower was heavily damaged by a blue dragon called Iryklathagra, also known as "Sharpfangs". The dragon's actions were due to the effects of the 'Rage of Dragons', and only a short time later she also destroyed the massive temple of Bhaelros (Talos) in Calimport.

Not longer afterwards, the western tower was "abducted" by a being called the Sojourner.

In late 1373 DR, Blackwill Haarken Akhmelere (high priest of the Eternal Eclipse) used an ancient and powerful artifact known as the Golden Lamp of Samesaj to repair the eastern tower and completely rebuild the western tower.

In mid 1374 DR, the western tower of the Eternal Eclipse was attacked by an unlikely alliance of Cyricists from the Dark Redoubt, Selunites from Hycont Abbey in Esmeltaran, and Loviatans from the Black Spires of the Maiden. Upon its fall, the Dark Redoubt claimed the tower as their own, as per a prior agreement with their temporary allies.

Shortly afterwards, the Dark Redoubt was destroyed by forces from the eastern Tower in retaliation.

A few months later, the government of Amn called a true with the Sythillisian Empire to fight a new common enemy, a race known as the Stingers. Given that the two warring Cyricist sects were on either side of the conflict, it is unclear whether there are still any active hostilities between them.

Edited by NiGHTMARE, 15 September 2006 - 03:25 PM.

[Andyr]

I've not read all the series so don't know how he develops, but TN sounds plausible to me.