24 replies to this topic

[Ascension64]

This poll has arisen because a number of people have been complaining that level progression is too fast through Baldur's Gate that resulted in a significant advantage through Baldur's Gate and possibly at the start of Baldur's Gate 2, which made the game a fair bit easier upon transition (note that starting a normal SoA game gives you 89,000 experience equivalent to level 7/8 for all basic classes).

I am a little bit undecided, so I here is a poll that allows you to tell me what you prefer in relation to XP reduction to disarming traps, picking locks, and learning spells. Just to explain each choice, so you get a better idea:

General reduction for all levels -- this would result in XP reduction for the actions above for every single level possible, meaning that not only BG1 is affected, but BG2 and other mods are also affected provided that they don't overwrite the file that controls the XP bonus (XPBONUS.2DA). Could be good for a BP-kind of overall reduction.

Reduction from levels 1-9 only -- this would result in XP reduction for the actions above only for levels 1 to 9, meaning that all of BG1 would most likely be affected (I don't know about you, but BGT+SoBH+NTotSC+DSotSC resulted in a level 10 character for me in the transition WITHOUT new XP reduction implemented into the mods). However, this may still remain effective in BG2 until you get to level 10, thereby slowing down XP gain for the first portion of the game, which could mean the game is a little harder at first.

Reduction from level 1-7 only -- this would result in XP reduction for the actions above only for level 1 to 7, meaning that BG2 would most likely be unaffected except the final small amount of XP required to get to level 8 for most classes, but there is a large chance that the BG1 portion of the game will result in a character of greater than level 7 (think Eye of the Beholder series) that will negate any XP reduction following that. Not such a bad thing because the experience gap is higher, for example and may be the most balanced decision.

No reduction at all -- this would result in no XP reduction for the actions above. XP gain will be somewhat accelerated and may leave you quite high level for battling Sarevok and even during the first part of BG2. However, this is classic BG2-style BG1, if you like.

Poll will remain open for two to three weeks. May you choose wisely. Feel free to post any comments below.

EDIT: The question of optional/compulsory change is not related to this one, but it would be good to write a comment on this as a post, rather than allowing it to cloud judgement for the question above. Basically, if there are enough votes for people who prefer NO REDUCTION, then I will lean towards making it optional. However, if other votes are overwhelming, then it might be compulsory. But again, if you want to see it optional, say so in a post, don't deliberately vote for no reduction.

Edited by Ascension64, 07 June 2005 - 09:57 PM.

[caretaker1]

I don't have a preference, but it seems like it should be a stand-alone, optional patch, so people who didn't want it wouldn't have to take it to play.

My $.02

[noname]

I don't have a preference, but it seems like it should be a stand-alone, optional patch, so people who didn't want it wouldn't have to take it to play.

My $.02

I would prefer to keep the XP system the way it is but I like the idea of having it being an option.

[Ascension64]

OK, I should make this clear. The fact of the matter is, if there is going to be a reduction of XP gain, what should it be? The question of whether it is an option or not is something different altogether. Please don't let this other matter affect the vote. The above two comments are good examples of what should be considered.

Edited by Ascension64, 07 June 2005 - 07:30 PM.

[Suluku]

I have played the BG1 section of BP-BGT twice now (with SBH, TGC, DSotSC and NTotSC installed) and both times I found that all the extra XP from the mod quests boosted the party to level 10 by the end of BG1. That, along with all the extra magical armour and weapons, seriously overbalances the game in my opinion. Some people may enjoy setting the party AI to 'attack enemies on sight' and sitting back and watching the slaughter, but I don't. The only fights that offered any real challenge in BG1 were the final battle of DSotSC and the last two battles of NTotSC, all of which were fun.

So, I'm in favour of a reduction in XP awards for the entire game. However, SimDing0 of PocketPlane fame has already produced an XP reducer that, I believe, will work for all IE games in its latest version. Maybe those of us in favour of an XP reduction can use that, and also win some brownie points for diplomacy

Edited by Suluku, 08 June 2005 - 01:49 AM.

[cujo]

I have voted to have it reduced for all levels. I like the idea of it being optional though so people can't complain about getting less XP.

Has anyone ever created a thief for BGT and put all the points in lock picking? There are lots of chests you can open in Candlekeep alone and I believe I was already level 3 when I got out of it.

Kick Imoen out of the party, head over to the FAI and there you can open some more chests, go to Beregost and open everything there (you only unlock the chests and don't steal from them so no guards are called) and before you get to Nashkel you are already level 4 or 5. If you start picking up party members now you get a serious strong party before you actually "start" the main quests.

Because of the amount of mods available now there is a lot more XP out there from quests and random encounters so I don't think it's going to be a problem to have the XP reduced. Especially if people are going to use it with BP.

[PolarBear]

I voted for general reduction. Tho, making it optional can't hurt I guess

[Peeter]

General reduction. I'd like my lvl 8-9 spells to come in a timely fashion.


By the way, it could be possible to program this, I'm not sure, but it'd be fancy if the XP reward for lockpicking and disabling traps would grow per level of the thief. So lockpicking 50 points per level and disabling traps 100 xp points per level for example would be nice.

[masteraleph]

I voted for general reduction. If you play all the way through BG/TotSC, you should be around level 9 already by the time BG2 starts. However, if we presume that people are going to be playing every mod possible, then they'll have BG1, ToTSC, NTotSC, DTotSC, and then in the beginning of BG2 will fairly quickly get whisked off to NEJ. All in all, they'll be at a rediculous enough level by the time they get back to BG2 that you'd have to expand the bonus reduction to 12/13...at which point it should start anyways, since few in the realms should have locks that allow a level 12/13 thief to be learning anything new.

[Eon Blue Apocalypse]

I voted for general reduction. If removing bonus xp is not sufficient, adjusting xp needed for level up charts across the board can provide for an additional clean and easy solution.

[hlidskialf]

Alternately, you could just script in an XP cap for the BG1 portion of the game, and have it removed for the start of BG2. A bit of scripting and effects via the DPlayer scripts would handle that nicely. You could also easily make it an alternate component of the installation.

[Ascension64]

Alternately, you could just script in an XP cap for the BG1 portion of the game, and have it removed for the start of BG2. A bit of scripting and effects via the DPlayer scripts would handle that nicely. You could also easily make it an alternate component of the installation.

Could you give me an example of an XP cap script?

[Chevalier]

I want extra levels out of SoBH and DSotSC, but not too much xp. Slow things down some, but not so much as if you didn't play the extra mods.

[hlidskialf]

A way to do a XPCap in-game is to simply script a check for a player's current XP being greater than the cap, then reducing it to the cap. Easy addition to the DPlayer or Baldurs series of scripts. (Arguements for both are there.) Something simple like:

IF
  XPGT(Player1,89001) //Arbitrary XP cap.
THEN
 RESPONSE #100
  AddXPObject(Player1,-1000) //Negative numbers subtract XP.
END

This will remove 1000 XP from Player1 until it falls below the cap. Repeat a block for each Player1 through 6 and tack it onto the baldur.bcs script. Since you have a BG1 section and cutoff for BGT already, it'd be an easy addition.
Note, this method is sloppy since a large XP addition can raise a character's level before this kicks in. Thus you could have a character with a higher level (with it's benifits) than the XP allows. Not likely, particularily in BG1, but possible. Also, you could add a DisplayHeadString that lets the player know that the XP coming off is due to the cap. Something like, "XP Cap procedure in effect" or somesuch.

[Ascension64]

A way to do a XPCap in-game is to simply script a check for a player's current XP being greater than the cap, then reducing it to the cap. Easy addition to the DPlayer or Baldurs series of scripts. (Arguements for both are there.) Something simple like:

IF
  XPGT(Player1,89001) //Arbitrary XP cap.
THEN
 RESPONSE #100
  AddXPObject(Player1,-1000) //Negative numbers subtract XP.
END

This will remove 1000 XP from Player1 until it falls below the cap. Repeat a block for each Player1 through 6 and tack it onto the baldur.bcs script. Since you have a BG1 section and cutoff for BGT already, it'd be an easy addition.
Note, this method is sloppy since a large XP addition can raise a character's level before this kicks in. Thus you could have a character with a higher level (with it's benifits) than the XP allows. Not likely, particularily in BG1, but possible. Also, you could add a DisplayHeadString that lets the player know that the XP coming off is due to the cap. Something like, "XP Cap procedure in effect" or somesuch.

Thanks. I might give that a try after I see what the final results for this poll are.

[King Diamond]

A way to do a XPCap in-game is to simply script a check for a player's current XP being greater than the cap, then reducing it to the cap. Easy addition to the DPlayer or Baldurs series of scripts. (Arguements for both are there.) Something simple like:

IF
  XPGT(Player1,89001) //Arbitrary XP cap.
THEN
 RESPONSE #100
  AddXPObject(Player1,-1000) //Negative numbers subtract XP.
END

This will remove 1000 XP from Player1 until it falls below the cap. Repeat a block for each Player1 through 6 and tack it onto the baldur.bcs script. Since you have a BG1 section and cutoff for BGT already, it'd be an easy addition.
Note, this method is sloppy since a large XP addition can raise a character's level before this kicks in. Thus you could have a character with a higher level (with it's benifits) than the XP allows. Not likely, particularily in BG1, but possible. Also, you could add a DisplayHeadString that lets the player know that the XP coming off is due to the cap. Something like, "XP Cap procedure in effect" or somesuch.

It's crazy and absolutely not in vain of a common sense IMHO. Having hardly earned experience to be stripped in a blink of an eye in a middle of something by absolutely unknown reason.... That will ruin all the perfect expression of playing whole BG1 part.

[hlidskialf]

What, and the orignal XP cap made sense? I merely offered an option.

[PolarBear]

Anyway, xp awards for spells shoud be trimmed eighter way. Or this could result players hitting the cap just after the first half of the BG1 part.

Edit: my bloody English

Edited by PolarBear, 10 June 2005 - 02:58 PM.

[horred the plague]

Do you mean trimmed from where the original game stood on this, or trimmed from the tables I made? I ask because what I did already was a sharp reduction from the regular game settings.