154 replies to this topic

[NiGHTMARE]

I'm not sure how far you want to go to make the geographical features of this map resemble the "official" version, but here a few things regarding Amn anyway:

- perhaps a label for the Cloudpeaks?

- the Smallteeth mountains should be somewhat further south, so the top is more-or-less parallel to the bottom of Lake Esmel

- the above would neccessite moving Murann slightly further south, but this is correct anyway:). Murann should be parallel with Trademeet.

- a couple of rivers seem to be missing. One starts at Lake Esmel, and ends up on the coast roughly halfway between Athkatla and the Smallteeth mountains. The other starts at the top of the Smallteeth mountains (north north west of Trademeet) and ends up at the coast, slightly below the other missing river.

- the name of the second missing river is the Imnescourse, and it's my guess that Imnesvale (in the Umar Hills) would probably be named after it and hence be relatively near it.

- there should be another mountain range south of Lake Esmel. It's western tip should be slightly southeast of the eastern tip of the Smallteeth range, and it's width twice that of Lake Esmel.

- there should be a group of hills slightly east of the above mountain range, and run for about 1/3 the width and 1/2 the height (as in north/south rather than up/down ). They're slightly north north west of Riatavin, and due south of the Troll Mountains.

Edited by NiGHTMARE, 10 March 2005 - 04:45 PM.

[Yacomo]

I'm not sure how far you want to go to make the geographical features of this map resemble the "official" version

Thanks a lot again NiGHTMARE! Yes, I will continue working on this, so your information is very valuable for me - keep em coming :thumb:

Fixing the geography is of course one of the issues on my list. Adding more 'props' like streets, rivers and simply some things to make the map look more interesting is also there. However the very first thing I'll do when I touch the map graphics again is reduce the size of the labels and city icons, they cover far too much real estate now.

Once the map is up I hope you'll have a look at my future plans in the readme. Then we can start a community discussion what needs to be done most urgently...

* Edit *

For current download links, please see my signature.

Edited by Yacomo, 14 March 2005 - 09:33 PM.

[King Diamond]

Great work, m8! :thumb:

1st bug (or something like that): there's an always visible location marked as Watcher's Keep with an icon of some part of Baldur's Gate just west of Athkatla in the middle of the sea (near the ship)...

Edited by King Diamond, 11 March 2005 - 07:14 AM.

[Yacomo]

Great work, m8!  :thumb:

1st bug (or something like that): there's an always visible location marked as Watcher's Keep with an icon of some part of Baldur's Gate just west of Athkatla in the middle of the sea (near the ship)...

Thanks for the info!

I remember that Watcher's Keep did indeed point to an icon from BG at the time I started with the wmp file, but I thought that I fixed that one. Any chances that you loaded an old save game instead of starting a new one?
Otherwise I must have messed this one up, maybe there's a conflict with xlnewarea, will check this later when I'm back at home (still at work at the moment)

* Edit *

Hmm, maybe I can debug this one out of my head - the bam sequences for BG start somewhere at around 28, while Watcher's Keep should point to something around 90. So could you do me a favour and have a look via NI at the wmp in your save-game to which sequence number your Watcher's Keep points? Thanks!

And it shouldnt be always visible - this definitely sounds like a bug

Edited by Yacomo, 11 March 2005 - 07:38 AM.

[King Diamond]

I remember that Watcher's Keep did indeed point to an icon from BG at the time I started with the wmp file, but I thought that I fixed that one. Any chances that you loaded an old save game instead of starting a new one?
Otherwise I must have messed this one up, maybe there's a conflict with xlnewarea, will check this later when I'm back at home (still at work at the moment) 

* Edit *

Hmm, maybe I can debug this one out of my head - the bam sequences for BG start somewhere at around 28, while Watcher's Keep should point to something around 90. So could you do me a favour and have a look via NI at the wmp in your save-game to which sequence number your Watcher's Keep points? Thanks!

And it shouldnt be always visible - this definitely sounds like a bug 

My NI can't open it

There's a 'good' WK at its correct location with a correct icon.
But that 'extra' one still there too

And yes - I started a new game.

[Yacomo]

My NI can't open it 

Then it most likely needs more memory, try starting it with a batch file that contains this line:

java -Xmx512m -jar NearInfinity.jar

(will add this to the readme for v2)

There's a 'good' WK at its correct location with a correct icon.
But that 'extra' one still there too 

Thanks, images tell more than thousand words! Obviously I messed up here, guess this really has something to do with xnewarea... I'll check when I get home and fix this for v2.

* EDIT *
Yes I guessed right, there is an empty xnewarea.2da in my override. A quick search shows that this one comes from Check the Bodies. Consider this one fixed and thanks a lot for pointing this out :thumb:

* EDIT 2 *
If anybody is annoyed by this bug, you can just open xnewarea.2da and remove the only entry within. Don't worry, Watcher's Keep will not disappear since it is integrated into the main BP-BGT worldmap file.

Or just wait for v2, which will most likely be finished by the end of this week and which uses mospack as well as offering TuTu support B)

Edited by Yacomo, 15 March 2005 - 04:53 AM.

[Yacomo]

I know it would be a lot of work, but if I may offer a suggestion... the original SoA map was extremely buggy and inconsistent. I'd suggest, as long as you're revising the worldmap, to build the various BP.* worldmaps off the one in the G3 Tweak Pack. It does not make any MOS changes, but it adds and fixes a number of travel links. It also adds a few new entry points to an area or two so you no longer get dumped randomly into areas like the Small Teeth Pass.

Hi CamDawg,

Is this offer still valid? If you do not object, I'll merge your worldmap changes into the current BP-BGT worldmap for a future release. Would be one step more towards the 'ultimate' worldmap

Thanks,

Yacomo

[Yacomo]

Hi folks,

v2 of the map is up on the mirrors. This time I even wrote an official announcement which can be found here.

Have fun!

Yacomo

[Eon Blue Apocalypse]

A quick question: is TOB on the same map as the rest of the game?

[Yacomo]

A quick question: is TOB on the same map as the rest of the game?

You'll be laughing at me, but I can't answer that question (I never got that far in a BP-BGT game, only played four weeks, then I started working on this )

What I can tell you is that the locations are all there, but I doubt that they are used. At least, when you start a new ToB game, then you get the 'classic' ToB map.

It would however be an easy change to replace the ToB map with the new one, so if people are interested, I'll add this as an optional component to a future version.

[horred the plague]

A quick question: is TOB on the same map as the rest of the game?

You'll be laughing at me, but I can't answer that question (I never got that far in a BP-BGT game, only played four weeks, then I started working on this )

What I can tell you is that the locations are all there, but I doubt that they are used. At least, when you start a new ToB game, then you get the 'classic' ToB map.

It would however be an easy change to replace the ToB map with the new one, so if people are interested, I'll add this as an optional component to a future version.

What I had done, is use the same map--but with the MoveToExpansion function still intact. That way, if any modder wanted to add a "BG1/BG2 revisited" mod to the Picture, the map was there for them to use.

[Yacomo]

What I had done, is use the same map--but with the MoveToExpansion function still intact. That way, if any modder wanted to add a "BG1/BG2 revisited" mod to the Picture, the map was there for them to use.

Oh, that's cool! You learn a new thing every day - since I only changed locations and fixed some area link issues this should still be working.

Horred, just to give me a better understanding of things and to make sure I did not break anything:

Is it right (was it your intention) that the original ToB map is used when I start a ToB game directly?

And if so, how did you manage to make MoveToExpansion() not to change maps, thought it would always do this?
I fear that I may be using the 'wrong' ToB .wmp file at the moment - will have to check where this originally came from this evening, probably it is from CtB.

Edited by Yacomo, 21 March 2005 - 04:14 AM.

[horred the plague]

What I had done, is use the same map--but with the MoveToExpansion function still intact. That way, if any modder wanted to add a "BG1/BG2 revisited" mod to the Picture, the map was there for them to use.

Oh, that's cool! You learn a new thing every day - since I only changed locations and fixed some area link issues this should still be working.

Horred, just to give me a better understanding of things and to make sure I did not break anything:

Is it right (was it your intention) that the original ToB map is used when I start a ToB game directly?

And if so, how did you manage to make MoveToExpansion() not to change maps, thought it would always do this?
I fear that I may be using the 'wrong' ToB .wmp file at the moment - will have to check where this originally came from this evening, probably it is from CtB.

No, use the same SOA map, for both games.

Overwrite WORLDM25.mos (think that's what it's called) with your new WORLDMAP.mos. That's how you keep the same (but different) maps.

[Yacomo]

No, use the same SOA map, for both games.

Overwrite WORLDM25.mos (think that's what it's called) with your new WORLDMAP.mos. That's how you keep the same (but different) maps.

Oh, that's cheating - I thought there were some clever tricks involved

Errm, guess I should rather replace the ToB .wmp file with the SoA one, this way we can save about 20meg of disc space. Makes two different maps, but they would use the same image, no need to duplicate the mos file B)

Will add an option to use the original ToB map for those that insist on doing so...

[horred the plague]

No, use the same SOA map, for both games.

Overwrite WORLDM25.mos (think that's what it's called) with your new WORLDMAP.mos. That's how you keep the same (but different) maps.

Oh, that's cheating - I thought there were some clever tricks involved

Errm, guess I should rather replace the ToB .wmp file with the SoA one, this way we can save about 20meg of disc space. Makes two different maps, but they would use the same image, no need to duplicate the mos file B)

Will add an option to use the original ToB map for those that insist on doing so...

Errm, that's what I meant, actually. Just change the .wmp mos refererrence, and you'll be fine.

Someday, if somebody makes such a mod that would actually require a whole new world, I might go through the work of actually adding ToB into SoA. If Vlad actually follows the course he had originally laid out for Neverending Journey (and decides to show us a little bit more cooperation over this way )--I would do the work for both him and for BP. And, help with that final chapter he had planned for NeJ. Call it a tradeoff. Cause his original plan would be best done with a whole new worldmap (and thus, a new expansion package).

[Yacomo]

Someday, if somebody makes such a mod that would actually require a whole new world, I might go through the work of actually adding ToB into SoA. If Vlad actually follows the course he had originally laid out for Neverending Journey (and decides to show us a little bit more cooperation over this way  )--I would do the work for both him and for BP. And, help with that final chapter he had planned for NeJ. Call it a tradeoff. Cause his original plan would be best done with a whole new worldmap (and thus, a new expansion package).

Here we have a nice thought But could it work? I mean you can MoveToExpansion(), but can you LeaveExpansion()?

About NeJ: That is something I wanted to ask about a long time ago, but forgot. Do we want to add new map areas for it? I guess the game can still support a far larger map and we could do it similar to the way Lendore is handled for BoneHill. Of course we would need Vlads permission for this...

A side note about the ToB map, at times I was hoping that someday someone would think about expanding the ToB part of the game and allow you to travel through the planes like a demi-god should be able to do (can you say Planescape Torment), giving you lots of 'exploded' planes (on the world map) where you could travel to. Well you can always dream...

[horred the plague]

Someday, if somebody makes such a mod that would actually require a whole new world, I might go through the work of actually adding ToB into SoA. If Vlad actually follows the course he had originally laid out for Neverending Journey (and decides to show us a little bit more cooperation over this way  )--I would do the work for both him and for BP. And, help with that final chapter he had planned for NeJ. Call it a tradeoff. Cause his original plan would be best done with a whole new worldmap (and thus, a new expansion package).

Here we have a nice thought But could it work? I mean you can MoveToExpansion(), but can you LeaveExpansion()?

No, you can't LeaveExpansion()--but there are workarounds, depending on what needs to be done--remember, this is all just armchair philosophy at this point. You could, for example--make an area map that resembles a worldmap. You'd walk across it large scale, like some ancient nintendo game--and hop in the "hole" (trigger region) that takes you to the new areas. TriggerActivation() could turn the areas on/off as the plot thickened. When you leave the area, you return to your nintendo worldmap and hop in the next hole. :thumb:

This system could accomodate any number of "worldmaps", planes??? etc -- whatever was needed/desired.

Edited by horred the plague, 21 March 2005 - 09:22 AM.

[Yacomo]

No, you can't LeaveExpansion()--but there are workarounds, depending on what needs to be done--remember, this is all just armchair philosophy at this point. You could, for example--make an area map that resembles a worldmap. You'd walk across it large scale, like some ancient nintendo game--and hop in the "hole" (trigger region) that takes you to the new areas. TriggerActivation() could turn the areas on/off as the plot thickened. When you leave the area, you return to your nintendo worldmap and hop in the next hole.  :thumb:

This system could accomodate any number of "worldmaps", planes???    etc -- whatever was needed/desired.

Ahh, now here we have some clever trickery Of course this is armchair philosophy - but who knows what we will be doing in ten years

Please excuse my insistance on this, but what do you think about the NeJ Worldmap issue? Do you think it would be worth the effort to include it into the current map as some kind of 'exploded' map?

[Eon Blue Apocalypse]

You're referring to the IWD areas? You could increase the map's size and fit them on it, in the upper left corner... but it's a different time, isn't it?

And I'm all for making TOB use the same map. Can't the SOA->TOB transition be restyled into what the TotSC -> SOA transitions is like now?

[bpfan]

Just to throw in the two-cents on the IWD area...well, I think if you're up to it, adding it would be a great thing to do. If Vlad doesn't his program to reflect the map, well, that's certainly his choice. If someone doesn't install, NeJ, well, the map's just bigger and has areas he'll never visit.

And if someone else at some point decides to set a BP mod in the area of the Ten-Towns...say, for example, once BP 1.7 is released and I play at least as far as getting clear of Chateau Irenicus and figure out how to use DLCTEP and start trying to incorporate IWD2...then a big piece of work I wouldn't have a clue how to do will already be done!