193 replies to this topic

[Ascension64]

Yep. The topic title says it all. Still a fair bit of work to do, but there is light at the end of the tunnel. Things that I still need to do are:

1. World map
2. BIFFing of files other than tilesets
3. Implement the appropriate fixes from S&H Patch 6, SBT14, and KD's fixes
4. Write a readme
5. TEST IT TO SEE IF IT REALLY WORKS PROPERLY
6. Upload to TheWizard, which will take a while since I have max upload speed of 12kb/s and the package will probably be huge!

The first public release of this will probably be a version 0.5 for four reasons:

1. There will likely be bad some StrRefs for a number of creatures and areas (because I am not as talented as Horred, but creatures especially since I used a rather unorthodox method to go through all 2000 of them)
2. Left over files that are supposed to affect BP instead of just BGT may 'hurt' BP, so we have to clean those out
3. Untested compatibility with TDD-WeiDU, SoS-WeiDU, TS600, and the as yet unreleased BP170
4. I am not exactly sure whether all the modifications to the ruleset have been made (2DA and IDS), so it may need testing on that department

So, don't get your hopes up too soon. This will take me a while to do because I have much RL, and I trashed the last five days of it doing this for you all. I hope it works...

Edited by Ascension64, 07 February 2005 - 07:53 AM.

[SimDing0]

A transition for Tutu didn't sound like a good idea then?

[Ascension64]

A transition for Tutu didn't sound like a good idea then?

It's attractive, but sounded harder.

[SimDing0]

Shame. It would've been easier.

[King Diamond]

I suggest you to make a package of game files for download without any .tiz for now, 'coz everybody (who's interested in) have original BGT already and could use it's areas subfolders to make new version installer. As it exists for CtB or an old DSotSC: areas' package that is large and game files that is much smaller.

It would be nice to handle over smaller package for bugtesting...

Oh, yes, and one more thing....
I would start to work with CLEAR BGT install - just ToB+original BGT, nothing else - to make it's WeiDU version (may be you are doing the same ). It shouldn'be touched by any other mods IMHO (except Ascension and Baldurdash that are already there) + BGT specific fixes only....

Edited by King Diamond, 07 February 2005 - 11:33 AM.

[Radwen]

I guess all I can say is, Thanks ! This will be great for all. If your overloaded or something, send me a pm. I'll gladly help this noble project of yours !

[Dennis]

Ambitious project Ascension64.

Congrats on even starting this thing, and thanks for doing so.

I look forward to enjoying the fruits of your labours.

Dennis

[Ascension64]

I suggest you to make a package of game files for download without any .tiz for now, 'coz everybody (who's interested in) have original BGT already and could use it's areas subfolders to make new version installer. As it exists for CtB or an old DSotSC: areas' package that is large and game files that is much smaller.

Very good idea, KD. What I was planning is for something similar to DSotSC, with files that don't change much in one archive (area graphics and music) and the other one, but since everyone will have the area graphics and music, they won't even need the package.

I would start to work with CLEAR BGT install - just ToB+original BGT, nothing else -  to make it's WeiDU version (may be you are doing the same ). It shouldn'be touched by any other mods IMHO (except Ascension and Baldurdash that are already there) + BGT specific fixes only....

That is what I am aiming at, but the way BGT and its major fixes have been packaged in BP-BGT packages makes it a tinch difficult, that is why I intend to figure out which files will interfere with BP (the extra changes that come out should not affect a ToB BGT install in any way, that's why it needs testing on the BP platform, but certainly, it needs to work on ToB first)

Edited by Ascension64, 08 February 2005 - 07:35 AM.

[Yacomo]

Wow Ascension64, I am impressed that you even dared to start this project I had a look at all the files in BGT at the weekend and I must say that I do not even have a clue where to start... There seem to be so many redundant files from BG2 in there and then the nightmare of putting together all the fixes from various sources

If a newb with only a few hours of NI-experience can help you, I'll gladly offer you a hand.

Btw: If everything is rebuilt - wouldn't it be a good idea to check the BGT14 patch for fixes still missing in BP-BGT? Well maybe that is something I could do...

[SimDing0]

It's really not too late to just take the worldmap and transition stuff that you've presumbly converted to WeiDU and modify it to be slapped on top of Tutu. Really.

Edited by SimDing0, 08 February 2005 - 12:40 AM.

[King Diamond]

That is what I am aiming at, but the way BGT and its major fixes have been packaged in BP-BGT packages makes it a tinch difficult, that is why I intend to figure out which files will interfere with BP (the extra changes that come out should not affect a ToB BGT install in any way, that's why it needs testing on the BP platform, but certainly, it needs to work on ToB first)

Frankly saying I've started the preparations for BGT-Weidu myself a week ago ... :^^: So I'm offering a little help to you....

I made some 'investigations' of existing BGT and ToB packages on that matter and found some interesting things.

One of it, there're A LOT of BG1 stuff already exists in ToB installation. I think Black Isle guys were just too lazy to clean up everything, so they left some resources to make our work easier.... Especially for sounds. So I already have BGT installation .bat file with only necessary wavs being imported from bg1. This reduces a final install size on up to 100MB. So you can skip this small step. It's done.

But some of items, creatures, scripts(!) (and everything else) are there too partially. They are just need to be revised for changes/variations.

For now I separated clearly BG1 stuff from Ascension/Baldurdash resources to make life easier, 'coz we can borrow that stuff from SoS/TDD Horred's install (he did that twice for now - proper Acs/BD-weidu for those 2 mods ). That will save a little time and efforts IMHO as well.....


And one more.... I took a quick look at BP-BGT contents and I'm almost sure now that that is everything we need to concentrate attention at...'coz it duplicate BGT contents. May be with some alterations that should be figured out.... And it IS WeiDU

[Yacomo]

It's really not too late to just take the worldmap and transition stuff that you've presumbly converted to WeiDU and modify it to be slapped on top of Tutu. Really.

Well, I'm a mere mortal when it comes to modding and I cannot decide which path would be easier. This is something you legends out there have to decide.
I do know that it is not good to have two rivaling mods that do more or less the same, but the reluctance on this topic in this board indicates that using tutu may not be as simple as it sounds and simply throwing away five days of work by Ascension64 (and years of bug-fixing for BP-BGT) sounds like a dramatic waste for me. On the other hand, being a software-developer myself I know that it is sometimes better to completely replace an old product before fixing it forever...

It would be very interesting to hear the oppinion of some of the modding-legends on this topic.

Anyway, I am willing to help with whichever path you choose. I personally simply want to have one huge game with as much content in it as possible

[SimDing0]

Well. I'm fairly confident that it wouldn't been easier to add a transition for Tutu than to WeiDU BGT from the start. However, I'm not entirely sure how much work Ascension64's done on this, and yes, it'd obviously be frustrating for it to go to waste.

However, I think even at this stage, Tutu could still be used with fairly minimal difficulty, with a better end result in the long term. Merging projects results in better concentration of bug reports and better standardization, providing benefits to both modder and end-user; not to mention the drastic change in download size. The only benefit of sticking with WeiDU-BGT at this stage, as far as I can see, is perhaps that it's slightly easier from the modder's perspective. Only slightly, mind you.

A lot of the work WeiDUing BGT would, I suspect, be transferrable with a few changes to resorce references. The worldmap and the actual transition between BG1 and BG2 is what I'm thinking of here. One major issue would be TotSC, since Tutu doesn't place it after the end of BG1. I don't think it'd be a great loss to drop that part of the transition, but I don't know whether you guys would prefer to keep that aspect, in which case it might be a little more work.

It's always possible that there's some aspect of the matter that I've neglected to mention/consider, in which case by all means somebody fill me in.

[Chevalier]

Haveing played plain BGT and Horred's BP-BGT, I find Horred's game kicks ass! You fight tuff and smart monsters! Now if BGtutu is just BG1 with BG2 rules it is way too easy. We power modders like our games with the most letters, like BP-BGT-NeJ-SoBH-DTotSC-NTotSC-IR-CtB-DR-UB-DSoA-ABCDEFGHIJK..........

[SimDing0]

With the advent of WeiDU-BP, I'd imagine it'd be possible to get it working over Tutu.

[Yacomo]

Haveing played plain BGT and Horred's BP-BGT, I find Horred's game kicks ass!  You fight tuff and smart monsters!  Now if BGtutu is just BG1 with BG2 rules it is way too easy.  We power modders like our games with the most letters, like BP-BGT-NeJ-SoBH-DTotSC-NTotSC-IR-CtB-DR-UB-DSoA-ABCDEFGHIJK.......... 

What is DR am I missing something

And what the hell is ABCDEFGHIJK???

But serious: Horred's work on BP-BGT is really incredible :thumb: and this definitely has to be included in whatever the new 'mega-mod' will be...

[Chevalier]

DR = Dark Ritual

[Yacomo]

@Ascension64: Are you interested in removing the XPPatcher from the new BGT install? I could code a few .tp2 lines for you that do the same stuff.

Edit:
@KingDiamond: Is it really necessary to include the tis-files in BGT? According to IESDP there is no difference between BGI and BGII tis - in that case coulnd't they be just copied over?

Edited by Yacomo, 08 February 2005 - 06:48 AM.

[Ascension64]

One of it, there're A LOT of BG1 stuff already exists in ToB installation. I think Black Isle guys were just too lazy to clean up everything, so they left some resources to make our work easier.... 

Yep, noted that already. For example, instead of manually 'fixing' the CREs with DLTCEP/NI using the information from the BP-BGT.tp2 file, I simply extracted most of the CREs from the BG1 installation and threw them in.

Especially for sounds. So I already have BGT installation .bat file with only necessary wavs being imported from bg1. This reduces a final install size on up to 100MB. So you can skip this small step. It's done.

That sounds good. Maybe you could just give me a file list of the WAVs since I already have a large WAV folder and my batch just copies it all over and BIFFs it straight away. I guess the .bat will do if you are willing to send it over.

But some of items, creatures, scripts(!) (and everything else) are there too partially. They are just need to be revised for changes/variations.

Already done, mostly... The important thing here is the StrRefs. I have pretty much stamped out most of these because most StrRefs for BG1 are still contained in exactly the same position as the BG2 dialog.tlk file. Very useful, huh?

For now I separated clearly BG1 stuff from Ascension/Baldurdash resources to make life easier, 'coz we can borrow that stuff from SoS/TDD Horred's install (he did that twice for now - proper Acs/BD-weidu for those 2 mods  ). That will save a little time and efforts IMHO as well.....

Again, could you give me a filelist?

And one more.... I took a quick look at BP-BGT contents and I'm almost sure now that that is everything we need to concentrate attention at...'coz it duplicate BGT contents.    May be with some alterations that should be figured out.... And it IS WeiDU

mostly, I took the first couple of days separating which files were only in BGT, which were replaced by BP-BGT, which were new in BP-BGT, which were replaced by BP-BGT-NeJ Patch 313, and which were new in BP-BGT-NeJ Patch 313. Seems like I am several steps ahead of you at the moment.

@Ascension64: Are you interested in removing the XPPatcher from the new BGT install? I could code a few .tp2 lines for you that do the same stuff.

Already done. But thanks for the offer.

Just a little progress update for everybody now...

The install works quite well at the moment. A number of CREs and DLGs have references to sections of IDS that really shouldn't appear, so I am suspecting that all these files that are generating the WARNINGS from WeiDU are NOT BG1 (i.e. entries in GTimes.IDS, Spell.IDS, Stats.IDS, and Shoutids.IDS). Secondly, some internal labels in DLGs are missing, but they will be very easy to sort out when I fix the bug described below. They are all the errors I know of so far.

On another note, the game has some trouble running. KD, you might know something about the game freezing on the LOADING AREA screen. It seems to happen with all the BG1 areas I try to CLUAConsole into (and starting a new game) so I suspect it might be some mismatch with tilesets or WEDs or something, but I need some suggestions here.

One thing to work on is the changed GUI. I know CtB has a very simple one that replaced the NEW GAME button with BALDURS GATE I and the TUTORIAL button with BALDURS GATE 2. Should be very easy to do.

Currently, the package can be installed WITHOUT BG1 installed. I know this is not ideal because it bumps up the installation size a fair bit, but the reason why this is so at the moment is because WeiDU is unable to open BG1 and extract files into BG2 (as far as I know that is). Just like Bardez did, a .bat file would work at the start of the install to extract necessary files, but then whats the point of WeiDU?

Edited by Ascension64, 08 February 2005 - 07:55 AM.

[SimDing0]

Yeh, it's nice to see you're taking my suggestions under such serious consideration...

Edited by SimDing0, 08 February 2005 - 08:02 AM.