10 replies to this topic

[PolarBear]

Okay, I've been off for the week, took a bloody hard exam at university (and passed it btw ), and meanwhile I was thinking.
The thing is so simple that someone must have thought about it before me, please don't swallow me in that case, since I'm totally new to both this community and modding.

My idea (or rather just a mere thought) is: Why don't we just separate the character creation (I mean PCs of course) from the game? If there'd be a program that could create proper .chr files, we could just import them to our games and that's it. My point is that this way the enduser could menage all the kits installed (not just 9 for each class/race) and even mage kits (maybe barb/sorc/monk aswell?) along with their race/stat restrictions, maybe even custom (sub)races could be manageble?

Another question comes to mind here tho: would an avarage user like this method? I mean running a program for character creation instead creating it ingame.

[Andyr]

You can have more than 9 kits installed per class.

You just can't see more than 9 per class as there's not enough space on the screen to display them all. They can still be picked with Near Infinity, Shadowkeeper or by scripting or whatnot. There's not really much need of a workaround.

When it is added to the game, each kit is added to KITLIST.2DA and given the next free number. So users with different kit installation orders will have different numbers for the same kit. So a separate program to make the .CHR would have to make sure it checked the end-user's install for what kits it has and in which order anyway, making the whole thing sort of pointless.

Just be selective in the kits you install - most newer mods allow kits to be selected individually, so I don't see many circumstances when you'd have more than 9 kits for one class installed.

Igi also made a tool somewhere to displace newly-installed kits to the top of the list, so you'll be able to select them from the ingame menu. I don't remember the URL, though.

Sorcerors, Monks and Barbarians cannot have true kits. Nor can you add steps to character creation to choose subrace. Mods which attempt these sorts of things would tend to have options chosen via dialogue at the beginning of the game, or something.

[PolarBear]

First about subraces: You are right, but results of these dialogs are saved if you save your game/export your char, aren't they? Yes, you can't add a new step to ingame char creation, but adding this new step to this uh... thing should be easy... You should know, you have been messing around with a C++ compiler, haven't you?

About kits: yea you are right, you can have so many kits and you need only one per game. It is all about comfort really. One can not create true
monk/barb/sorc kits, but I've seen a sorc kit (implemented with a workaround), and making similar "not true" kits are possible, aren't they? With a separate program you can display them as anything you like.

So a separate program to make the .CHR would have to make sure it checked the end-user's install for what kits it has and in which order anyway, making the whole thing sort of pointless.

Piece of cake

NI is great, but in this case once you create your char, let's say a mage, and you want to add your custom kit with NI, but (I think) you may have to add the spacial abilities (innates) of the kit at your level manually, (I don't know anything about scripts tho).

So if a program could do the char creation entirely (including racial enemies for rangers, spell selection for wizards, randomization for char stats, etc), we might have an easier, more sophisticated method for using custom kits, and even more (one could add as many steps as he wants). It would allow better flexibility and wider compatibility with mods IMO. It is NOT THE sollution, it's just a better sollution.

(There are some difficulties tho: for spellcasters the available spells should be checked, since there can be custom spells installed aswell...)

(Also note: If the user is an IE expert, the user won't need anything like that for sure )

[PolarBear]

I forgot to add something: I'm confident I have the neccessary skills to write such (need some research done on GUI under windows tho), but I don't know much about the build up of .chr or spell files...

Edited by PolarBear, 06 February 2005 - 09:55 AM.

[the bigg]

NI is great, but in this case once you create your char, let's say a mage, and you want to add your custom kit with NI, but (I think) you may have to add the spacial abilities (innates) of the kit at your level manually, (I don't know anything about scripts tho).

Start game as a pureclass fighter*, save your game. Open NI, change class & kit, remove all weapon proficiencies effect, set level to 0 while mantaining your XP and reducing the HP to 1. Open game, do all your sudden level-up and voila, you have your abilities. If you are crazy about cheating, open up NI again and remove an HP.

* a fighter has less effects to take care of

[PolarBear]

Ah, in that case, I apologize. The rest of my post is alive tho. But if you think that making such is really pointless, then I won't even try.

[igi]

I like this idea, though I dont know what anyone else thinks.
I'll see how much time I get at the weekend.

[PolarBear]

That'd be great since I'm not experienced with all this trendy "Visual" stuff (I've written only console apps so far, that's all what they teach at uni in the first 2 years ) , even though I intend to get familiar with Visual C++ after I finish an RL issue (moving). But again, I'm not much into IE. So I'd need to look into various things first which could take long.
So I guess it'd be a lot easier to you to make it than it'd be to me
If you feel like it, then go for it.

[igi]

That'd be great since I'm not experienced with all this trendy "Visual" stuff (I've written only console apps so far, that's all what they teach at uni in the first 2 years ) , even though I intend to get familiar with Visual C++ after I finish an RL issue (moving). But again, I'm not much into IE. So I'd need to look into various things first which could take long.
So I guess it'd be a lot easier to you to make it than it'd be to me
If you feel like it, then go for it.

Console apps rule. And are much easier to make, given that I dont have an IDE to do visual form creation for C++.
However, I do happen to have Delphi 7 laying around :-D

So, to recap - this program is just to externalise character generation?
I've done a little work, I am almost tempted to release a concept program to show what I've got in mind, but I dont want people to see how far is left and shrug off the idea. So, I may wait another week, when it should be done (at least for an alpha).
Any comments anyone?

[PolarBear]

Console apps rule. And are much easier to make, given that I dont have an IDE to do visual form creation for C++.
However, I do happen to have Delphi 7 laying around :-D

Yea, I hear Delphi is a "visual pascal" of some sort. I know some pascal, but I prefer C(++) all the time . Starting with Delphi'd be easier for me aswell I guess, but I want to go big

So, to recap - this program is just to externalise character generation?

Exactly.

I've done a little work, I am almost tempted to release a concept program to show what I've got in mind, but I dont want people to see how far is left and shrug off the idea. So, I may wait another week, when it should be done (at least for an alpha).
Any comments anyone?

I'd love to see it. Or even the source of it (tho I know I'm asking too much here ).
As soon as I find my place I would gladly offer some help to you, though I do know how bad is it to read and try figuring out somebody else's code

About what others think: how would I know. It is also possible that most ppl here don't have clue what we are talking about and why would it be that good. I'm just one, but I'd love to see, what you found out about this.

[igi]

Yes, Delphi is the a visual extension of Pascal. I am undecided as to how much I like it, but, since I can use it, I guess I like it

Recap - cool. I want to add a little more than just plain duplication.
I'll upload it somewhere, and PM you the location tomorrow, I'd love some feedback, on the program, and my crazy scheme.
As for source code, I would say no, but, having lost my HDD recently (hopefully the nice data recovery company will get it back for me), I've no adopted an open-source-ish approach. So, yeah, you can look, when it's done. Just dont expect some miracle code. Most things I write for the IE tend to be huge switch statements