58 replies to this topic

[Laufey]

Laufey, just as Jason said: it is your mod and it is your vision of Edwin, and it is great that you are developing them. So the following are just notes, not critisizm or anything adverse.

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I am not quite sure how an egotistical person can be selfless (I'd call it a contradiction in terms) and Edwin is the epitomy of egoism. Basically, his attachment to whores/chambermaids coming streight out of there: that type of man prefers woman below them in social status/intellect/beauty/everything, so I actually think that your restriction on intelligence is well...not warrented.

Every parameter of NPC is an "artificial constraint" defining certain characteristic of an NPC - what can we do - it is a game! Alignment defines his/her outlook on life and relationship with society and others. You would not expect a character with 5 strength to use a two-handed sword. You would not expect a person with lore of 0 to identify Equilizer's pommel jewel. So why would you expect a lawful servant of evil to fall for a paladin, and vice versa? My understanding is that a paladin/any good character would attempt to surrender Edwin to authorities based on his attempted murder of Dynaheir, attempt to hire you as a killer and his attempt to kill you when you refuse to be a murderer.

Now, if you say Edwin is not exactly evil character, than well, you are departing from in-game Edwin and using "in the cards edwin". So basically what it all boils down to is may be it is sort of warranted to switch his starting alignment to LN?

Domi, I agree that a paladin and Edwin would be *less* likely to fall for each other than Edwin and certain other classes. However, I prefer to have as few constraints as possible. I basically think the player should get the opportunity to make that choice. Some people may think it plausible for such a romance to play out, some not, but I want the opportunity to be available, just the same as it is possible for a paladin to romance Viconia if the player wishes to do so.

Now, I am not about to go into a huge debate on what is good or what is evil, or what different alignments mean, or what a 'good' person should or shouldn't do, since it's a topic that people never agree on anyway, but my view is basically: If you think you can roleplay a paladin romancing Edwin, then do so. The dialogue options will allow for it. If you don't think it's possible, then don't do so, but I don't wish to be the one to tell players what is possible and what isn't, or at least I wish to do so as little as possible.

The intelligence restriction is there because Edwin as I see him would soon get extremely bored with a woman who was too far beneath him intellectually. He might dally with her for a while, but it would never be true love, and that is what the romance is supposed to be about.

[Nyx]

Now, if you say Edwin is not exactly evil character, than well, you are departing from in-game Edwin and using "in the cards edwin".

Wasn't it the other way around? Which is to say, wasn't In the Cards written with the Romance's Edwin, rather than the romance being written with Cards'?

-Nyx

[Laufey]

Now, if you say Edwin is not exactly evil character, than well, you are departing from in-game Edwin and using "in the cards edwin".

Wasn't it the other way around? Which is to say, wasn't In the Cards written with the Romance's Edwin, rather than the romance being written with Cards'?

-Nyx

Yes, quite right. The Romance was written first, and the Edwin of 'Cards' grow and developed out of it.

[Eocine]

Makes me want to dust off my "Bruce, the Cockney Barfighter" mod.

Now that I'd like to see.

[Eocine]

Or rather hear.

[zan]

Jason, first of all you are forgetting that we girls generally like 'bad boys' and Edwin appeals to majority of ladies out there exactly for the same reasons that you as a male do not like him!

And the amount of new quests, interesting new characters and really good humor in this mod will surely compensate you for Edwin somewhat loose principles!

ah, but isn't that the point?

Edwin is a bad and naughty boy. Even if we do choose to put alignment aside (I think I may have beaten that horse to death already), it's his base character - in every single sense of the word, heh. Whores, dubious morals, blistering insults, and all that goes with it Remove that, and is it truly still Edwin? i have to admit i think it would be interesting if the relationship wasn't "High Fidelity"....sort of the anti-Anomen. Could still quite easily be romantic - think of how many girls Haer'Dalis probably has on the go but, it is, of course, your mod.

it's going to be a fine line to call. my own opinion is that if one likes a character, then no great overhauls should be necessary. I am very glad that the alignment switch is not going to be compulsory, no forced redemption...good call there.

all said, a mod is a mod, and if you can pull it off then all due respect. good luck to all of you

zan (tiggeriffic attic refugee)

(and no relation to Saru, save the monkey )

[dorotea]

Whores, dubious morals, blistering insults, and all that goes with it  Remove that, and is it truly still Edwin?

Actually, I think - 'yes' ! Because he will still be extremely annoying, charismatic and oh so clever! I just love Edwin's witticisms in the Romance!

He is extremely acerbic and yet .. touching. As for his whoring ... well I always had a suspicion that it was more blabber than action. Let me put it this way - no real womaniser that I know in RL would talk about it all the time. But a wannabe will. So when Eddie finally gets a real wommann in his hot little hands, not the imaginary one, he is all set! And as far as I remember both Mazzy and Vic turn him down in the game.

zan (tiggeriffic attic refugee)

(and no relation to Saru, save the monkey

Glad to see you here!

PS

Does it mean we will never see another Kaleidoscope!

Oh horror unimagined!

no forced redemption...good call there

Is it a stone in my little glass house?

[Laufey]

Edwin is a bad and naughty boy. Even if we do choose to put alignment aside (I think I may have beaten that horse to death already), it's his base character - in every single sense of the word, heh. Whores, dubious morals, blistering insults, and all that goes with it Remove that, and is it truly still Edwin? i have to admit i think it would be interesting if the relationship wasn't "High Fidelity"....sort of the anti-Anomen. Could still quite easily be romantic - think of how many girls Haer'Dalis probably has on the go but, it is, of course, your mod.

Zan, I hope and firmly believe that yes, you will still find Edwin very recognizable, as Dorotea already said. Without going into another tedious alignment discussion, personally I see Edwin as somebody who doesn't commit easily, but will be very loyal once he finally does. I also think that characters should evolve over time. Not become another person, never that, but that their personalities should become a little more multifaceted and more threedimensional, the way real people do when you get to know them better. So while Edwin will still be *very* sarcastic, witty and insulting, we will also get to see other aspects of him, and I hope the people who like him will enjoy my version.

It's always very difficult to discuss things beforehand, and I don't want to sound boastful, but if you do decide to play the romance through, I think you will probably like it.

[Ophidia]

I am not quite sure how an egotistical person can be selfless (I'd call it a contradiction in terms) and Edwin is the epitomy of egoism. Basically, his attachment to whores/chambermaids coming streight out of there: that type of man prefers woman below them in social status/intellect/beauty/everything, so I actually think that your restriction on intelligence is well...not warrented.

I just thought I'd revisit this reply with an observation of my own. I've met a number of Edwin-like people in real life- highly intelligent, woman-chasing (or desperate) and convinced they're the best thing since sliced bread. They tend to look for women who are 'below them'- but if they meet a woman who can keep up with them, who can actually win an argument against them, they fall head over heels for said person. I've seen it happen a number of times, and it's very sweet to watch .

I am convinced the int restriction is justified in this mod, because we're not talking a dalliance here, but a sincere attachment. That always requires a meeting of minds.

[Laufey]

I just thought I'd revisit this reply with an observation of my own. I've met a number of Edwin-like people in real life- highly intelligent, woman-chasing (or desperate) and convinced they're the best thing since sliced bread. They tend to look for women who are 'below them'- but if they meet a woman who can keep up with them, who can actually win an argument against them, they fall head over heels for said person. I've seen it happen a number of times, and it's very sweet to watch .

I am convinced the int restriction is justified in this mod, because we're not talking a dalliance here, but a sincere attachment. That always requires a meeting of minds.

Couldn't agree more of course. Actually, I also took the time to dig through some of my old reviews, and it was as I thought I remembered it. It was Dave G. of Bioware who originally suggested the Int restriction, since, as he put it, "Edwin would never go for a low-Intelligence woman (at least not in the more-than-physical sense)". And having thought about that, I agreed with him and implemented it.

Also, allowing for Int 3 characters to romance Edwin would necessitate complicating the dialogue with even more possible paths. I have inserted more dialogue options for the PC since I first published the Lovetalks in the Attic, to reduce the possibility of the player thinking I'm 'leading them by the hand', but I think adding 'stupid' replies would simply be too much trouble to be worth the effort.

[luek]

Like so many others I bemoaned the lack of alternative male NPC:s to romance, and Edwin has always been my favorite, so it was a very natural choice.

This is a FANTASTIC idea!!!!!!!!!!!!! I'm really looking forward to this mod. From the teasers you and your co-conspirators added, you've put a lot of time and effort into this, and the mod will definitely make BG2 much more enjoyable.

[Laufey]

This is a FANTASTIC idea!!!!!!!!!!!!!  I'm really looking forward to this mod.  From the teasers you and your co-conspirators    added, you've put a lot of time and effort into this, and the mod will definitely make BG2 much more enjoyable.

Thank you very much!

It's always great to hear from somebody as appreciative as you are, and I hope you will enjoy the mod once it's done. We're doing our best to make it worth playing.

[Ophidia]

Like so many others I bemoaned the lack of alternative male NPC:s to romance, and Edwin has always been my favorite, so it was a very natural choice.  

This is a FANTASTIC idea!!!!!!!!!!!!! I'm really looking forward to this mod. From the teasers you and your co-conspirators added, you've put a lot of time and effort into this, and the mod will definitely make BG2 much more enjoyable.

Glad you liked my little teaser I hope you like the mod when it comes out!

[Kayli]

Though I've always been a big fan of Edwin (along with Xan and his delightfully fatalistic manner), when my friend told me that someone had an Edwin romance mod in the works I have to admit I was a bit sceptical. After reading all that you have here, though, I really am impressed. I think you have a really good grasp of his personality, and you keep the elements of humor that are integral to his character.

As someone said earlier, girls /do/ like jerks, so long as they're done in a certain way. Anomen was a jerk, but he was too serious and whiney. Edwin is a jerk, but he's /funny/ and that makes all the difference.

I'm also fond of ego done in a humorous fashion - and I do think that an egotistical person can be selfless....he'll just be very impressed with his own selflessness and heroism afterwords. XD I'm currently working with my friend on a Haer'Dalis Romance mod (posted at the Chosen of Mystra forum), and ego plays a huge role in writing for him as well.

So yes, I think you're doing a wonderful job. Keep up the good work!

[Laufey]

Though I've always been a big fan of Edwin (along with Xan and his delightfully fatalistic manner), when my friend told me that someone had an Edwin romance mod in the works I have to admit I was a bit sceptical. After reading all that you have here, though, I really am impressed. I think you have a really good grasp of his personality, and you keep the elements of humor that are integral to his character.

As someone said earlier, girls /do/ like jerks, so long as they're done in a certain way. Anomen was a jerk, but he was too serious and whiney. Edwin is a jerk, but he's /funny/ and that makes all the difference.

I'm also fond of ego done in a humorous fashion - and I do think that an egotistical person can be selfless....he'll just be very impressed with his own selflessness and heroism afterwords. XD I'm currently working with my friend on a Haer'Dalis Romance mod (posted at the Chosen of Mystra forum), and ego plays a huge role in writing for him as well.

So yes, I think you're doing a wonderful job. Keep up the good work!

Thank you very much! We're busy doing the programming part of the Edwin mod, and I hope you'll enjoy playing it when it's done. Good luck with Haer'Dalis!

[Laufey]

Yay, the Edwin romance is becoming a reality! hehe I just love Edwin and I always play through with him in my parties, regardless of alignments.

I remember reading the Edwin romances on the Attic and I think I saved em all, somewhere as well. So, I'm excited!

And yeah, I always got the impression that he is trying to come off as more of a stud than he really is, i.e. "...left many a concubine gasping under my erotic onslaught". hahaha I laughed out loud at that one. Plus, he's always hitting on different chicks in the party, with no success.  

So, thanks! Any ideas on when this might be coming out?

Always good to hear from a fellow person of good taste (Edwin lover)
Am very happy to hear you enjoyed reading the romance, and I hope you'll enjoy playing the mod as well. As for Eddie's experience in bed, I think he's boasting and exaggerating just a *little* bit, but has plenty of natural skill to compensate.

About the timeframe I can't give an exact date, but the programming is progressing steadily. Rest assured...the Red Wizard will Erotically Onslaught all females willing to give him a chance.