37 replies to this topic

[discharger12]

Which god, out of all would win? From what I can tell Ao is the Overlord, so he doesn't count.

I mean, if put through peliminaries (spelling?) who would win? (This includes dead gods such as Bhaal)

example

Talos---------
------- Bhaal
Bhaal---------
---------Bhaal

Salvanus------
------ Salvanus
Lathandar-----

etc, etc.


I'm guessing that it's not as easy as Tempos (and yes, it is Tempos) is the best!

IF that's the case, then do it by picking your favorite

I have quite a fancy for Mystra, being all about Magic :^^:

Edited by discharger12, 08 November 2004 - 01:30 PM.

[Deva]

Ehh.. I think Talos would beat Bhaal..
Lathander would beat Silvanus...
Mystra would beat Tempus..

But that's just my humble opinion.

[NiGHTMARE]

Greater gods would easily beat any god of intermediate status or lower. Intermediate deities would in turn easily beat any god of lesser status or lower. Lesser gods would easily beat a demi-god.

Greater: Akadi, Amauntor (became Lesser after the fall of Netheril and before his death), Bane, Chauntea, Cyric, Grumbar, Istishia, Kelemvor, Kossuth, Lathander, Myrkul, Mystra, Oghma, Shar, Silvanus, Sune, Talos, Tempus, Tyr.

Intermediate: Beshaba, Bhaal, Gond, Helm, Ilmater, Mielliki, Selune, Tymora, Umberlee.

Lesser: Auril, Azuth, Deneir, Eldath, Ibrandul, Iyactu Xvim, Leira, Lliira, Loviator, Malar, Mask (formerly intermediate and briefly demi), Milil, Moander (became demi for a time before his death), Shaundakul (formerly demi), Talona, Torm, Waukeen.

Demi: Finder Wyvernspur, Garagos, Gargauth, Gwaeron Windstrom, Hoar (formerly lesser), Jergal (formerly greater), Karsus, Lurue, Nobanion, Red Knight, Savras (formerly lesser), Sharess, Shialla, Siamorphe, Ulutiu, Uthgar, Valkur.

Of the greater deities, if we're just talking a straight fight, then one way to rank them is by the character levels of their avatars:

Bane = 111*
Shar = 110
Myrkul = 91
The Elemental gods (Akadi, Grumbar, Istishia, Kossuth) = 90
Silvanus = 85
Cyric = 84**
Oghma = 83
Mystra = 80
Talos = 79
Kelemvor = 76
Amauntor = 73
Sune = 65
Tyr = 63
Lathander = 61
Tempus = 60
Chauntea = 60

* note that this is before his death. Comparing his post-resurrection levels would involve converting 3E->2E, which I can't be bothered to do right now )

** he would presumably have had more than this while he still had the portfolios of the dead and death, but there are no official stats for that.

[discharger12]

If Helm is intermediate, why is he revered much more then say Beshaba, or Mielliki? I mean, I've never even heard of Mielliki!

And what of Torm? I though he was some extremely important god. But I guess that only applies to Paladins... I think.

Edited by discharger12, 08 November 2004 - 02:33 PM.

[NiGHTMARE]

Uh, the vast majority of rangers in the Forgotten Realms worship Mielliki . She has a vast number of half-elf worshippers too, since some consider her to be a half-elf deity (they believe her father was Silvanus and her mother Hanali Cenalil, which apparently isn't actually true). Many dryads and even some elves worship her as well.

[discharger12]

Uh, the vast majority of rangers in the Forgotten Realms worship Mielliki .

....oh. Then why haven't I heard about him? (or her) Are there any established temples for him in Amn, or even in the BG area?

[NiGHTMARE]

Because you haven't read enough sourcebooks?

Mielliki has very few temples anywhere, but then none of the nature deities do - instead they tend to have small shrines tucked away in secluded forest glades.

[discharger12]

Because you haven't read enough sourcebooks?

Mielliki has very few temples anywhere, but then none of the nature deities do - instead they tend to have small shrines tucked away in secluded forest glades.

Gotcha

I need to buy a book on D&D gods. All very fascinating.

[Galactygon]

You don't have to read the books to learn a great deal about FR matters. There is a D&D section of the forum that contains quite a number of useful links and tidbits that you can use for your own advantage.

It's best to not buy most (non-3E?) rule-books simply because many (remote) sites contain all the info you need for 0.000000000 euros (or dollars).

-Galactygon

[discharger12]

That's very true, thanks

[Stone Wolf]

My vote is clear:

The Lady of Pain

The Lady is a mystery. She's widely regarded to be the de facto ruler of Sigil, its protector and its victim. She is said to guard the doors of the Cage against the myriad schemes of the gods, to be the ultimate expression of balance in teh multivers, to be the prisoner of the City of Doors. There are thousands of stories about her - one even tells that she's actually six giany squirrels with a headdress, robe, and ring of levitation and illusions - but none of them can be answered. She is a true enigma, a puzzle with no solution.

If someone displeases her - by upsetting the balance of the city or worhipping her - the Lady may punish the offender. Her punishment ranges from the Mazes - a twisting, turning hell with a cleverly disguised exit - to the casting of her shadow across the transgressor, covering him with slashes and gouges from her sharp-edged shadow, leaving behind a pile of gore and viscera. Neither option is paricularly attractive.

She isn't a traditional power, but the last power that crossed her (Aoskar, Greater Power of Portals) died hard.

[Gabrielle]

If Helm is intermediate, why is he revered much more then say Beshaba, or Mielliki? I mean, I've never even heard of Mielliki!

And what of Torm? I though he was some extremely important god. But I guess that only applies to Paladins... I think.

Helm is Ao's official boot licker. I'm basing that on the Time of Troubles. :thumb:

[discharger12]

My vote is clear:

The Lady of Pain

The Lady is a mystery. She's widely regarded to be the de facto ruler of Sigil, its protector and its victim. She is said to guard the doors of the Cage against the myriad schemes of the gods, to be the ultimate expression of balance in teh multivers, to be the prisoner of the City of Doors. There are thousands of stories about her - one even tells that she's actually six giany squirrels with a headdress, robe, and ring of levitation and illusions - but none of them can be answered. She is a true enigma, a puzzle with no solution.

If someone displeases her - by upsetting the balance of the city or worhipping her - the Lady may punish the offender. Her punishment ranges from the Mazes - a twisting, turning hell with a cleverly disguised exit - to the casting of her shadow across the transgressor, covering him with slashes and gouges from her sharp-edged shadow, leaving behind a pile of gore and viscera. Neither option is paricularly attractive.

She isn't a traditional power, but the last power that crossed her (Aoskar, Greater Power of Portals) died hard.

I really don't think The Lady of Pain counts. She may be in the D&D universe, but not the forgotten realms.

When I say What gods kick ass in D&D, I really meant in FR.

[Barren Fischa]

@NiGHTMARE: Helm did defeat the first Mystra during the ToT, though...

@Discharger: Mielikki is the deity worshipped by Montolio, and later by the Drizzit.

[oralpain]

Of the greater deities, if we're just talking a straight fight, then one way to rank them is by the character levels of their avatars:

Bane = 111*
Shar = 110
Myrkul = 91
The Elemental gods (Akadi, Grumbar, Istishia, Kossuth) = 90
Silvanus = 85
Cyric = 84**
Oghma = 83
Mystra = 80
Talos = 79
Kelemvor = 76
Amauntor = 73
Sune = 65
Tyr = 63
Lathander = 61
Tempus = 60
Chauntea = 60

Many other factors would come into play besides the raw power (wich for gods of the same "rank" is so close) of each of the gods. Though if we are talking about a straight-up no nonsense fight (wich would never happen), I guess this would be a reasonable benchmark.

As for the levels of the avatars, this is one of the reasons I don't use the Faiths and Avatar's/Demihuman Deities, it drastically in flated the power of all FR deities' avatars, for no real reason. Combined with the inflation of many of the mortals, this throws the entire FR campaign setting out of wack with the rest of the multiverse.

For example in the realms Corellon Larethian's avatar is a Fighter/Mage/Bard/Cleric of levels 36/35/29/25. Every where else, or even the realms pre Faiths and Avatars, his avatar is a Fighter/Mage/Cleric of levels 19/20/10, wich fits in far better with the avatars of other greater gods, through out the multiverse.

Edited by oralpain, 08 November 2004 - 08:57 PM.

[Feanor]

Greater gods would easily beat any god of intermediate status or lower.  Intermediate deities would in turn easily beat any god of lesser status or lower.  Lesser gods would easily beat a demi-god.

Greater: Akadi, Amauntor (became Lesser after the fall of Netheril and before his death), Bane, Chauntea, Cyric, Grumbar, Istishia, Kelemvor, Kossuth, Lathander, Myrkul, Mystra, Oghma, Shar, Silvanus, Sune, Talos, Tempus, Tyr.

Intermediate: Beshaba, Bhaal, Gond, Helm, Ilmater, Mielliki, Selune, Tymora, Umberlee.

Lesser: Auril, Azuth, Deneir, Eldath, Ibrandul, Iyactu Xvim, Leira, Lliira, Loviator, Malar, Mask (formerly intermediate and briefly demi), Milil, Moander (became demi for a time before his death), Shaundakul (formerly demi), Talona, Torm, Waukeen.

Demi: Finder Wyvernspur, Garagos, Gargauth, Gwaeron Windstrom, Hoar (formerly lesser), Jergal (formerly greater), Karsus, Lurue, Nobanion, Red Knight, Savras (formerly lesser), Sharess, Shialla, Siamorphe, Ulutiu, Uthgar, Valkur.

Of the greater deities, if we're just talking a straight fight, then one way to rank them is by the character levels of their avatars:

Bane = 111*
Shar = 110
Myrkul = 91
The Elemental gods (Akadi, Grumbar, Istishia, Kossuth) = 90
Silvanus = 85
Cyric = 84**
Oghma = 83
Mystra = 80
Talos = 79
Kelemvor = 76
Amauntor = 73
Sune = 65
Tyr = 63
Lathander = 61
Tempus = 60
Chauntea = 60

* note that this is before his death.  Comparing his post-resurrection levels would involve converting 3E->2E, which I can't be bothered to do right now )

** he would presumably have had more than this while he still had the portfolios of the dead and death, but there are no official stats for that.

Why Chauntea is so weak ? Was not she the most powerful of the Greater Deities ?

BTW, if a GM sees this, I suggest moving the topic to the ADD forum.

[NiGHTMARE]

@NiGHTMARE: Helm did defeat the first Mystra during the ToT, though...

At that point Helm was still a god, while Mystra was "merely" divine energy trapped inside a mortal shell. I believe all the gods (except Helm) were about equal during the ToT, since there's a limit to how much of their divinity could be stored inside a mortal body.

[khay]

Moved where it belongs.

[Bane]

woot go Bane, Helm, Torm and Kelemvor \o/ :nana:

How did Hoar drop to demi status, anyone feel like messaging me a '(remote)' site?

Also you should think of allies, because although Shar is more powerful than Selune she hasn't got the great number of allies of Selune...etc. Shar may be building this up slowly (influencing Talona, Velsharoon (i think) and Shevrash..etc) but in the meantime Selune has more.

Down with Chaos! :nana: :thumb:

[oralpain]

@NiGHTMARE: Helm did defeat the first Mystra during the ToT, though...

At that point Helm was still a god, while Mystra was "merely" divine energy trapped inside a mortal shell. I believe all the gods (except Helm) were about equal during the ToT, since there's a limit to how much of their divinity could be stored inside a mortal body.

This is basically correct. All FR gods except Helm where reduced to a single mortal avatar with none of their divine abilities. Effectivly they were simply powerful mortals for the duration of the Time of Troubles.

If Helm really wanted too he could have slain any or all of them if he really wanted too, but of course he was too duty bound to even think of such a thing.